@bstrand In TBC, highlight all the as-staked points, right-click, convert to regular point (forget what they call it).?ÿ It leaves a bunch of items behind like 1000-1 where 1000 is the point name but you can easily delete those.?ÿ May need to hit the red ball (bottom of screen).
But as Rover83 points out "the much more difficult task of actually getting the crews to use it..."
Oh, if I had a nickel for every time a crew told me "the software doesn't do that!" or "there's no way to make things look right without fixing it in the office!"...
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If the codes aren't entered correctly, it's not going to come in correctly. True for any software.
But having the linestring control codes right there in icon form helps a lot. Way easier than trying to remember which code is Begin Curve rather than Begin Tangent Curve, or 3-Point Circle versus 2-Point. The icons find the code for you.
Not to mention all that stuff gets drawn right there on the screen, and it's the crew's job to make sure things are coming in correctly. They can see the site far better than me back in the office. There's no reason not to make it look right before bringing the data back. I used to spend a little time at the end of each day walking the site to make sure I tied in everything, and while I did that I was modifying line codes and cleaning things up. That's time well spent.
Honestly there's only one line code function from C3D that I really wish Access had: the point-on-curve code, which doesn't require the operator to try and tag the PC/PT, and instead calculates both for you using the entry/exit tangents on either side. Sort of the reverse of Begin and End Tangent Curve. Great for big sweeping curves where it's tough to tell where it actually begins or ends.
Nice!
I just did this and it appears the point snapped to its actual position.?ÿ I only shot 1 point this way before I backed out of the stakeout routine and decided to just eyeball the grid.
My question now is, is the point scaled to ground??ÿ I scaled the project earlier today and I didn't pay attention to this one point because it wouldn't cause problems if it were to be left out of the surface.?ÿ I'm just wondering if staked points are immune to scaling manipulation.
I think you just use the horizonal and vertical offset codes for this.?ÿ Unless I'm misunderstanding the goal.?ÿ Personally, I never use those codes because I don't trust the thing I'm offsetting to consistently be that far away.
My question now is, is the point scaled to ground??ÿ I scaled the project earlier today and I didn't pay attention to this one point because it wouldn't cause problems if it were to be left out of the surface.?ÿ I'm just wondering if staked points are immune to scaling manipulation.
Whatever they are at the time of stakeout, that's where staked points reside. Trimble refers to north/east/elev as "grid" even if local site settings have been applied. If you set up a ground system and import a CSV to stake, it treats those values as ground.
This means that staked points won't shift in TBC if you apply local site settings, because again as far as Trimble is concerned the operator meant to place them at those locations at the time of staking, in the coordinate system that was set up at the time.
The general rule is "don't import any CSVs or stake anything until your coordinate system is finalized". A corollary would be "don't set/stake anything if you're going to post-process".
But once converted to observations, the normal rules of TBC apply and it becomes just like any other observation in that project.
@rover83 i can??t like its acting crazy on my end. ?ÿI read the info this morning over a cup of coffee and was tickled pink about this release. It has some great things for sure. And I am so with you about getting field crews to use coding. ?ÿI truly do not understand why companies do not use this. We were doing field to finish with Wild Soft. SDR Map. TMOSS. Eagle Point. TDS Foresight. This is 2022 right. When I came back to the private sector a couple years ago now I swore I had gone through some time warp and went back in time. Heck last week for a construction job I built a mini little line work library. Because We have all these panels and stuff we have to map. Nothing fancy but it is better than connecting dots. And more efficient. I spent the day in the field today showing how to do it and getting the guys minds wrapped around it. Next step is to load it in the data collector so they can catch their mistakes on the fly. And my daily sketch should be easy to get out the door.
@rover83 I say history is close to repeating itself with this latest release. I compare the plane table surveying to having line-work with the new map screens on data collector. ?ÿI never ran a plane table but did read about them early in my career and the RLS showed me one and how it worked. He had it in his office. It was brilliant during manual drafting days. History always repeats itself. Just doesn??t always show up the same exact way. I might have to go back to field crew material just to master all the symbols and such.
I think you just use the horizonal and vertical offset codes for this.?ÿ Unless I'm misunderstanding the goal.?ÿ Personally, I never use those codes because I don't trust the thing I'm offsetting to consistently be that far away.
But you can't specify the code for the parallell lines and measuring the point for the offset may be a lot faster and delta EL may be more accurate.
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Good stuff to know.?ÿ I forget about the cad toolbar all the time and end up wasting panel spots on control codes.
And I had no idea Rover = Mr Glaves!?ÿ I feel kinda bad about giving you hard time here sometimes!?ÿ Haha?ÿ You were a huge help this past winter during the Spokane training and I've been warning various people down here about the steve jobs bozo explosion ever since!
@bstrand?ÿ
Thanks! I'm glad the training helped. I'll be at Dimensions in a couple of weeks and hopefully I can get schooled on some stuff. It's hard to keep up right now since we are so slammed with production work, sometimes I feel like I am falling behind on all the cool new features. Doing an ROS or ALTA brings in money but doesn't help us figure out how to improve in the future.
Eh, give me a hard time, we're all here to both help out and debate each other. I'm pretty stubborn, but still need to hear and understand other perspectives. Considering how fast things are changing these days, I think we're going to need a lot of debate and even arguments, plus some compromise, to figure out how to keep this profession going.
Anyone know if it's possible to make a DXF selectable if you transfer someone else's .job file (task scheduler file) over to your data collector? I was doing layout where someone else set a control point so I grabbed their job file from the server and used it. The DXF worked visually but when I went to check offsets from some curves it would not work and the DXF doesn't show up in the layer manager like it does when you add it manually to a new job. It also caused everything to freeze up between trying to check the offset and going to look at the layer manager.?ÿ
Anyone know if it's possible to make a DXF selectable if you transfer someone else's .job file (task scheduler file) over to your data collector?
If the DXF isn't in your collector, it won't be available for linking. The JOB file logs the fact that a file has been linked, but it can't pull the 3D information from the DXF and store it in the job.
Is the DXF on the cloud project? All the reference files are available to everyone on the project, and unless they're using a linked file that is outside of the cloud, it should be as easy as downloading all the project files and then the particular job you want to link to.
No cloud project, I just have access to the office server for uploads through a VPN.... normally I add the DXF through layer manager but this time I needed a control point another guy set so I got his .job download from the server and put it in my job folder. The DXF wasn't in layer manager but the line work all showed up.?ÿ
After the crash and going back into the job the linework is completely gone. It is in my DC as I've used it before in this subdivision in a different job but I guess it has to be added through layer manager even though the lines initially showed up.?ÿ
@350rocketmike?ÿ
You said the DXF was already on your controller? If that is the case, as long as it exists under the project folder (under Trimble Data/Projects/[ProjectName]) it will be available for linking. This is true for all projects; if there are any DXFs, XML, RXL, CSV, etc. in the project folder, Access will show it under the Layer Manager.
The only time you would need to manually add a file to the Layer Manager list is if it was located outside the project folder; that's when you would need to tap Browse at the bottom.
When this is done, the software assumes that the user intended to keep that file separate from the current project (since it was not brought into it in the first place) but will maintain that file path link. If that link gets broken (other project folder moved or deleted) that will throw an error, but all it will say is "file not found" and let the user continue to work without it.
If multiple users are running differently named projects for the same work on different controllers, depending on how they are storing and pathing to linked files could cause major headaches. All bets are off if a JOB file under a particular project name with a link to a differently pathed DXF (even if the same file/name) is transferred to a different controller with a different project name.
I'm not sure why the lines would be showing up without the DXF being in the layer manager.
@jimcox could probably confirm, but I'm 95% certain that JOB/JXL files do not store linework or any other geometry besides points and observations.
@rover83?ÿ
I'm not sure why the linework showed up either, but after the freeze up and the error message that happened when shutting down access it never showed up again.?ÿ
The DXF's on my controller are all in a separate folder called "new uploads" so I know where to find them. I could move them all to projects so they will show up in layer manager without browsing but will that cause any more stress on the software making it lag more??ÿ
Everyone is going to likely have a different job name even if working in the same place, as we are all importing a CSV and then adding DXF through layer manager. When finished we just put the .job file on the server in a properly named folder for the office to find it. Any comments on this workflow??ÿ
@350RocketMike
Makes no difference where the dxf is.
I would put it in the project folder.?ÿ
That way you have only one copy - each job works with that
And when you copy or move the project around, you have all the files needed
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Different job names won't be a problem, because in Access "project" and "job" have specific meanings.
But the project should be the same across all the collectors. This is where the cloud is critical - if a project is set up and all field & office members are added, they will all have access to the project. Then it's a one-stop shop for all data needed.
A project is the "bucket" under which any number of jobs (I tell staff to think of them as "tasks") can be stored. The project will have JXL/JOT templates with coordinate definitions + control points embedded, plus reference files (CSVs, DXFs, etc.) that can be linked.
Crews can pull the latest template down from the cloud project, start a new job (task) with the latest & greatest control already embedded in the correct coordinate system, start a base or total station setup, and then pull down any reference files that they might need for the day's work, turning them on or off as needed.
@rover83?ÿ
Does that not assume that were using the Trimble cloud? We're definitely not doing it that way, we have our own windows 10 server which we have access via VPN.?ÿ
I personally do basically all the construction so I have a project for every subdivision I work in, whereas the other guy that does a small amount of the construction jobs has one folder for all the local subdivisions.?ÿ
I also tried linking my csv's and switched back because it wasn't friendly with shooting check points on the original point name. I just started linking a previous job if I need a point that isn't in the new upload, as a workaround. So I have imported a CSV, linked a DXF and linked a previous job or any job that has points I need in it.?ÿ
But even today when I did this I shot a check to s control point and access said "this point already exists in a linked file" or something to that affect and I said okay then I didn't get my error to the original point like I normally would. I went into the point manager and down to my 917cp, clocked the tab and found the check point it had just stored and saw that the coordinate was only 0.003m different than the original. This is just a bit of an annoyance. I could stake it out first and compare but if I'm taking a GPS shot I'll want to compare the final coord once I finish the shot.?ÿ
@bstrand I sent a request a couple years back that like tbc or other office software being able to have a grid placed on the screen. And be adjustable i was rowing around in a boat taking shots and yest the scale bar is nice in the lower right corner but for young folks eyes. That would eliminate almost what you are asking. As you could just set the grid at 50 x 50 or whatever. Your feature is pretty handy as well. I don??t believe the staking to a line is all that difficult. You can either highlight and export the as staked points and just bring them back in or off to cad. Or just convert them. Not very difficult in TBC. Just a few extra steps.
@dave-karoly might want to mention the -1 is customizable in Trimble access. You don??t have to have that -1 or 1- i. That.l. We have ours set up so i am staking design point 222. I have it set up to add a 1 prefix so my as staked point is now 1222. ?ÿThat allows me to export those points to cad as cad don??t like the - ?ÿand i get a extra qa qc as designed points are in cad already etc . One thing about Trimble is it gives you so many ways to do anything. I have 2 TSC7 on a job and both were rental units. The young crews were ready to be off and running. I said hold on and we went through tge survey styles in both and stake out options. And made them equal for how things were stored. Then i showed them how to customize the stake out menu as they would like. Because that doesn??t affect me at all. Office side. Just takes those rainy days to play around. And get it figured out is all.