The adjoiner to land owned by my wife says that he had a surveyor work on his property a few years ago. There are no corner records or plat near the affected area from this surveyor available through the Iowa Land Records site where they should appear. The adjoiner may not have a copy of a survey either, as he said there was a dispute over the survey cost.
He says that he used his backhoe to help the surveyor dig for and find an old stone and a wrench marking the center of section. Since there is no corner record on file for it, shouldn??t he have to file?
He also could have set irons that would affect our property.
What is the Iowa threshold to require filing corner records and plats? If the surveyor says the survey was not finished, I suppose he doesn??t have to file a plat, but does that excuse him from filing corner records? Even if he set monuments?
Did he know the surveyor's name? Did you try calling that surveyor?
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There may only be two or three most likely survey firms in a rural area to have been called by the adjoiner.?ÿ I would attempt to determine who those may have been and contact each directly with the adjoiner's name.?ÿ If you find the correct firm, you may learn a lot about the adjoiner that could be helpful to you in the long term.
Did he know the surveyor's name? Did you try calling that surveyor?
Yes, I know the name.?ÿ I want to know what he was required to do before I call and maybe get brushed off.
Might try this if no one from Iowa responds soon.
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https://www.lawserver.com/law/state/iowa/ia-code/iowa_code_chapter_355
There may only be two or three most likely survey firms in a rural area to have been called by the adjoiner.?ÿ I would attempt to determine who those may have been and contact each directly with the adjoiner's name.?ÿ If you find the correct firm, you may learn a lot about the adjoiner that could be helpful to you in the long term.
As noted in the response I was composing when you posted, we do know the name.
I have plats and corner records in the sections of interest from 7 surveyors (plus an 1874 plat), of which 4 firms might still be candidates for future work. There's no monopoly in the area, probably because only one is in the same county and he is at the opposite corner.
We know the adjoiner is a pushy type who makes and spends a lot of money.?ÿ How accurate his discussion was remains to be seen.
Might try this if no one from Iowa responds soon.
I've scanned that section and others, but didn't find it clear what happens if he says the survey wasn't completed.
Not sure if Oklahoma statutes bear any semblance to Iowa's, but we did have an interesting board ruling a few years ago about corner filings.?ÿ One surveyor had done a good amount of work in a particular area for a client.?ÿ The survey was "finished" (a completed drawing) in a practical sense but never delivered due to a squabble over the fees.?ÿ One report (probably credible) was that the surveyor removed his pins after the non-payment.?ÿ The surveyor denied such.?ÿ But what the State Board centered on was his recovery of the existing land corners that require filing.?ÿ While our statutes state we have 90 days to file corner records "after the survey is complete", said statutes don't define completion.
In that particular case the surveyor was found negligent by the Board for not properly filing the recovered corners.?ÿ Their position was payment wasn't necessarily a proponent to completion.?ÿ But other cases have varied though.
I'm still trying to look up the details on that one.
We have had a huge survey project take place in a neighboring county with most of the work happening two to three years ago.?ÿ Plenty of land survey reference reports to be filed (200-300).?ÿ Last week I was looking for information in that general area and discovered those reports were filed recently.?ÿ An obvious case of nothing being filed until the overall job was completed.?ÿ This happens all the time along DOT projects.?ÿ The situation above was for a big wind farm covering many sections.
Speaking of wind farms.?ÿ There is such a project in my home county now.?ÿ To the best of my knowledge no surveyor connected with surveying over 100 sections has found their way into the county surveyor office to find records on section corners.?ÿ Hub Tack info is a fraction of what is needed to do the job correctly.
I would bet the case with the adjoiner is one where the project got started but never completed due to the payment issue.?ÿ A common situation is one where it is discovered fairly early after arriving on site that the effort to do the job correctly will take significantly more time and effort than anyone would have guessed.?ÿ Being honest upfront with the client can result in being told to go home......NOW......because it isn't worth that much to the client to continue.?ÿ Neither the client nor the surveyor walks away happy in most cases.?ÿ The surveyor knows the client is a liar and a cheap skate and the client knows the surveyor is a liar and a greedy b@$%@rd.?ÿ We've all been told by the client how the site is wide-open and you could drive your Lincoln to every corner, plus he swears he has already seen several of the controlling monuments you will need to do his job.....................and none of that is accurate.
Attempting to finagle someone to provide information, whether by government edict or gentle coaxing, may not work without some sort of compensation.?ÿ
Speaking of wind farms.?ÿ There is such a project in my home county now.?ÿ To the best of my knowledge no surveyor connected with surveying over 100 sections has found their way into the county surveyor office to find records on section corners.?ÿ Hub Tack info is a fraction of what is needed to do the job correctly.
There is a survey in the next section done by a guy from out of state (13 state licenses and CFEDS!) who lists wind projects among his specialties.
There is a big wind project that goes for miles and miles all around the wife's land but they didn't opt to build on hers.?ÿ They wanted to run the underground cable?ÿ and also move the monster crane across her brother's land, but changed their minds.?ÿ He severely restricted the path they could use because he had heard it compresses the soil so much things don't like to grow and crushes tile where it's been.
Many of the locals complain about the turbines, for reasons of sight and sound.?ÿ A guy has been charged with shooting out the warning light on top of one.?ÿ Rumor is that there are cameras on there that identified him.?ÿ Makes you wonder where to take a leak out in your own field.
I would bet the case with the adjoiner is one where the project got started but never completed due to the payment issue.?ÿ A common situation is one where it is discovered fairly early after arriving on site that the effort to do the job correctly will take significantly more time and effort than anyone would have guessed.?ÿ Being honest upfront with the client can result in being told to go home......NOW......because it isn't worth that much to the client to continue..
I can see that might happen a lot.?ÿ
In this case, the neighbor left the impression the work was done and an unexpectedly large bill presented without proper warning. I can see it being complicated, but the surveyor should have known that right away.?ÿ
The other side of the guy's land from us includes or abuts an abandoned railroad with pieces in various ownership, and includes or abuts several other small parcels that had been carved up long ago.?ÿ People are farming to the creek, railroad, and abandoned highway but that isn't where some of the lines fall.?ÿ It's likely there were no monuments on a lot of it and the deed descriptions won't mesh.
Like other places, its prescribed that I file a map within 90 days of the survey. My board of registration enforces this only if they are tipped off as to someone not doing so when they should. They usually give the surveyor a call to discuss and in almost all cases a map is filed post haste. I push this envelope sometime because physically going to file the map is a pain in the butt and I would rather wait until I have several before spending the time.?ÿ
I am licensed by the state to work on the behalf of the public so if I have information that should be shared with the public the simple fact that I was not paid for it is of no consequence. My BOR has made this clear in their publication and at public presentations that I've attended.?ÿ
I suggest that Bill just give the surveyor a call and chat with them about his wife's property. Or stop in with a sack of doughnuts and coffee or a fist full of old maps. The gentle approach is usually more effective (with me) than waiving a rule book in my face.?ÿ?ÿ
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Good question Bill. The Minimum Standards for Property Surveys under the Administration rules spells out what is required for every property survey also. However, I don’t know of a court case in Iowa that addresses what is required if the survey is not completed. The devil is always in the details. If the Surveyor set any of his monuments, another Surveyor is going to find them someday and will want to know why there is no plat or possibly Corner Certificates filed.
I would recommend calling the surveyor to get his side of the story without questioning that he has done anything wrong. You may or may not get a complete story, but it might be more enlightening than the neighbor’s story.
BTW, the surveyor would likely have very little to worry about from the Iowa Board if past history holds.
1. ILR is not the official repository. The County Recorder's office is. I've regularly seen ILR search miss existing records.?ÿ
2. The surveyor shall record the required certificate with the recorder and forward a copy to the county engineer of the county in which the corner is located within thirty days after completion of the surveying. My comment: There is no requirement to file if the survey was not completed. It could and should be as a professional courtesy if the surveyor is of the opinion the corner has been located but only as a courtesy.?ÿ?ÿ
3. Counties keep old county surveyors records of the interior stones in various places. Engineer, Auditor, Recorder or nowhere.?ÿ They are not all certified are found in the survey index.?ÿ
4. Finding a stone does not complete the survey without considering all possible evidence along with it.?ÿ?ÿ
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