I don't do them a lot but have a client needing one that's a little tricky.
Basically a parent parcel of approximately 100 acres and a leased area of 10 acres. They asked if survey could be limited to leased area and still meet current ALTA standards? Thoughts?
Thanks,
CC
I'm not an ALTA exbert, but I do a lot of them. I have done similar situations. Not necessarily a lease area, but only a smaller portion of a parent tract. Obviously, I chased down all of the necessary corners to properly tie the smaller tract to the parent piece. Just my ten cents... FWIW, I have done one of those for a Walmart.
Assuming the 10 acre lease area is precisely defined, I would have no problem doing an ALTA of the lease area with enough "extra" to confirm that there are no issues related to the entire parcel.
No problem. You are doing an ALTA on a furnished (recorded?) description of 10 acres. How it is owned: leased, land contract or mortgaged deed does not matter. But that's just my opinion and to quote an earlier reply, "I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night".
IF the legal description in the Title Insurance Commitment Report is for the 10 acres, you have no problem.
IF the Title Insurance Commitment Report addresses the current OWNERSHIP of the 10 acre parcel, you have no problem.
IF you DO NOT get a current Title Insurance Commitment Report or the legal they give you is for the total 100+ acres, you may have a problem.
You can always do the survey and note that it is a 10 acre lease parcel out of the 100 acre parent tract as described in Title Insurance Commitment Report Number XXX and dated xxxxxxxx and cover yourself that way.
It really depends on what you get for a Title Insurance Commitment Report.
The fun part comes when you discover the title people don't have a clue. They include every easement, etc. for the entire 100 acres and maybe a whole bunch more and then expect you to address all of these on your ALTA. So, you have to be 10 times smarter on title work than the people who get paid every day to do title work.
Confirming the boundary is the easy part. Discovering that the water supply to the 10 acres is controlled by a meter and valve on the other 90 acres creates little headaches that you must address somehow. It's not shown in the title report, but, if you have to leave the property to shut off the water when a main line needs work, you have a problem. You are the guy who is supposed to discover this little problem and help the dummies come up with a means of fixing it prior to your completion of your ALTA. If the only access to the parking lot, loading dock, etc. involves driving over the adjoining 90 acres, is this clearly addressed in the title work?
We do this quite a bit for one of our clients. Our commitments always have the a description for our easement or lease area, and any required easements. If the access or utilities are not in the provided easements, then we create the easements.
It has not been difficult so far, at least not on the projects th st I have done thus far.
Yup, what Holy Cow said. They will expect you to sort out the easements over the entire site. Also, does the lender or title company want Table A item 20, dealing with offsite improvements, easements, and monuments. You could wind up doing most of the 100 acres, which is fine as long as you priced it accordingly.
I also do a lot of this type of an ALTA/ACSM Land Title Survey and do not see a problem. One way that I learned to protect myself from the situation as Holy described above is to ask for a copy of the Exhibit B2 exceptions prior to giving your quote. Don't let them yank you around saying they don't have one, they always have a preliminary that made them decide they wanted a Surveyor to do the work.
Terry
The title people don't have a clue
> The fun part comes when you discover the title people don't have a clue.
It may be a minor point of semantics; but can you actually "discover" what is common knowledge?
> We do this quite a bit for one of our clients. Our commitments always have the a description for our easement or lease area, and any required easements. If the access or utilities are not in the provided easements, then we create the easements.
>
> It has not been difficult so far, at least not on the projects th st I have done thus far.
So, in your fee schedule you include "any required easements"? Shouldn't these be in a line item fee? That could be quite a lot of pro-bono. Just a thought.
We price them accordingly. If there are major differences, we are able to get change orders for major discrepencies.
It works out okay for most of the jobs. We already have a pretty good idea of what we are going to run into for most of the jobs. We generally have a prior title commitment, and the sites for these jobs are fairly small, and not too complicated.
The title people don't have a clue
I do not know all of the parties who have this common knowledge of the lease.
I could guess from my anecdotal experience, but there are many more looking
over my plat and descriptions. When Wal-mart is involved in the lease area,
the number of bankers and attorneys, probably increases by dozens.
Cheap updates are a no-no in my book. Thinking that a lease simplifies things
is another no-no.
