Both are words sometimes misunderstood because they can mean the same thing.
Azimuth has two meanings: vertical azimuth or horizontal azimuth.
Bearing has two meanings: horizontal bearing/absolute bearing and quadrant bearing.
Horizontal azimuth equals horizontal bearing/absolute bearing.
Bearing is used in aeronautical and nautical navigation to mean the absolute bearing from North.
Bearing is most often used in surveying to mean quadrant bearing.
Quadrant bearing can be written in two ways 145° = N 45° E, 245° = S 45° E.
However a bearing of 145° is an absolute bearing or azimuth of 145° or S 35° E.
Neither azimuth or bearing is a simple thing that can be useful without further explanation.
Paul in PA
> Both are words sometimes misunderstood because they can mean the same thing.
>
> Azimuth has two meanings: vertical azimuth or horizontal azimuth.
>
> Bearing has two meanings: horizontal bearing/absolute bearing and quadrant bearing.
>
> Horizontal azimuth equals horizontal bearing/absolute bearing.
>
> Bearing is used in aeronautical and nautical navigation to mean the absolute bearing from North.
>
> Bearing is most often used in surveying to mean quadrant bearing.
>
> Quadrant bearing can be written in two ways 145° = N 45° E, 245° = S 45° E.
>
> However a bearing of 145° is an absolute bearing or azimuth of 145° or S 35° E.
>
> Neither azimuth or bearing is a simple thing that can be useful without further explanation.
>
> Paul in PA
Aloha, Paul:
Thank you!:good: :good:
you kinda lost me on this part:
> Quadrant bearing can be written in two ways 145° = N 45° E, 245° = S 45° E.
I would call the first expression Azimuth, the second Quadrant
145° = S 35° E (45° = N 45° E)
245° = S 65° W (135° = S 45° E)
maybe I need a second cup of coffee
Peter,
It was a Freudian Slip.
In the recesses of Paul' subconscious , he has an envy of the SEC.
🙂
> you kinda lost me on this part:
> > Quadrant bearing can be written in two ways 145° = N 45° E, 245° = S 45° E.
>
> I would call the first expression Azimuth, the second Quadrant
>
> 145° = S 35° E (45° = N 45° E)
>
> 245° = S 65° W (135° = S 45° E)
>
> maybe I need a second cup of coffee
On some software programs the first number represents the quadrant, followed by the degrees in that quadrant. So....
145 = (1) first quad, 45 deg. or N45E
245 = (2) second quad, 45 deg. or S45E
I think that's what he meant.
Scott
Please explain to me what a vertical azimuth is?
Yo! Peter!
I thought I gave a big enough hint.
Surveying 101:
NE = Quadrant 1
SE = Quadrant 2
SW = Quadrant 3
NW = Quadrant 4
145.3025 [enter] is how you would input NE 45°30'25"
It was and is a fast way to enter data.
Been the input format for many years in computer programs and then data collectors.
Paul in PA
That is a confusing way to do an input for quadrant. Never used a cogo program that the input was that way. The ones I have used have been: 45^1, 45^2, etc. or 45-1, 45-2, etc.
Surveying 101: "Vertical Azimuth Versus Vertical Angle"
The Vertical Angle is measure above or below the horizon. For the vertical circle the horizon is 0°, + 1° is above the horizon, - 1 ° is below the horizon. Transits with vertical angles did no have full circles, but quarter circles instead, so your reversed vertical would agree with your direct vertical. Vertical angles requires that the +/- be recorded and vertical errors resulted when not properly recorded or not recorded at all.
To avoid this possibility of confusion the Azimuth Circle was adopted, the Azimuth or 0° was up, the horizon was at 90° direct and 270° reversed and it was not neccessary to record +/- angles. Instruments now note it as the vertical angle which it is not. It is an "azimuth angle" or "angle from the vertical".
Paul in PA
Surveying 101: "Vertical Azimuth Versus Vertical Angle"
> The Vertical Angle is measure above or below the horizon. For the vertical circle the horizon is 0°, + 1° is above the horizon, - 1 ° is below the horizon. Transits with vertical angles did no have full circles, but quarter circles instead, so your reversed vertical would agree with your direct vertical. Vertical angles requires that the +/- be recorded and vertical errors resulted when not properly recorded or not recorded at all.
>
> To avoid this possibility of confusion the Azimuth Circle was adopted, the Azimuth or 0° was up, the horizon was at 90° direct and 270° reversed and it was not neccessary to record +/- angles. Instruments now note it as the vertical angle which it is not. It is an "azimuth angle" or "angle from the vertical".
>
> Paul in PA
Or a Zenith Angle.
> That is a confusing way to do an input for quadrant. Never used a cogo program that the input was that way. The ones I have used have been: 45^1, 45^2, etc. or 45-1, 45-2, etc.
Confusing, yes at first. But very fast after you get the hang of it. We are talking some very old programs here.
SMI In HP 48, Not That Old
Every time I turn it on it works.
New enough for me.
Paul in PA
Surveying 101: "Zenith"
In my "Breed and Hosmer" , 1970, "zenith" was only used once in reference to a vertical line at the North Pole.
In celestial work the "vertical angle" above the horizon was also called "altitude".
Learn something one way early on and it kind of sticks with you despite what others say.
Paul in PA
Surveying 101: "Zenith"
> In my "Breed and Hosmer" , 1970, "zenith" was only used once in reference to a vertical line at the North Pole.
>
> In celestial work the "vertical angle" above the horizon was also called "altitude".
>
> Learn something one way early on and it kind of sticks with you despite what others say.
>
> Paul in PA
Yup. In all our instruments, the zenith is turned on instead of vertical angle and 0 is up and 90 is flat. Makes for the reduction to horizontal and elevations a bit more error resistant.
Yo! Peter!
> I thought I gave a big enough hint.
>
> Surveying 101:
>
> NE = Quadrant 1
> SE = Quadrant 2
> SW = Quadrant 3
> NW = Quadrant 4
>
> 145.3025 [enter] is how you would input NE 45°30'25"
>
> It was and is a fast way to enter data.
>
> Been the input format for many years in computer programs and then data collectors.
>
> Paul in PA
:coffee: :coffee: :coffee:
OK, I remember those softwares, never mind.
Azimuth Versus Bearing, Other Comments
Been looking through my first surveying text. Just checked some field note examples.
One for a survey had all vertical angles without +/-. Since it was not a topo survey it did not matter, the angle only being used to adjust the slope distance to horizontal. I can agree with that.
Another example on a route survey was a bit more problematic in my mind.
Sta. - Dist. - Az.Ang.
/ @ 6 - - O° on 1+62.47
1 - 298- 221°20'
2 - 238 - 217°15'
In the above azimuth angle was used instead of angle right, and on several other field note examples.
Paul in PA
SMI In HP 48, Not That Old
[sarcasm]Sorry, but in the world of electronics HP48 is an antique.[/sarcasm]
Still have one on my desk and yes it turns on, but all I use it for is simple math these days. I kinda feel sad now that I think about it 🙁 We have been together a long time. I could always tell which 48 in the office or truck was mine. When I shake it, it sounds like a maraca. Has always been something loose in there, kinda like me 😀 .
Surveying 101: "Vertical Azimuth Versus Vertical Angle"
Thank you. I have never heard it referred to that way. It just confused :bored: me a little. I have always called it a zenith.
Learned something new today... must be time to go home.
Yo! Peter!
> I thought I gave a big enough hint.
>
> Surveying 101:
>
> NE = Quadrant 1
> SE = Quadrant 2
> SW = Quadrant 3
> NW = Quadrant 4
>
> 145.3025 [enter] is how you would input NE 45°30'25"
>
> It was and is a fast way to enter data.
>
> Been the input format for many years in computer programs and then data collectors.
>
> Paul in PA
hp quadrants
