do you think this will happen? I think at least 15 years. I remember talking about this same subject 10 years ago from the machine control dealers (who at the time said 5-10 years).
Extracted from this article about 3/4 ways down.
"In the future—as designers gain more experience with modeling—the quality of modeling will increase, the comfort with delivering them as part of the project (not without being compensated handsomely I hope) will increase and they will become more common. At some point in time, a model will supersede the construction documents as a form of design documentation. Contractors will be required to construct the project based on a model, not on construction documents."
I hope I placed this in the correct category. Please move if deemed necessary.
Thad
In Oklahoma construction and contract documents have always included the 'plan sheets' and contract text (verbage). If models aren't already provided with some contracts, I'm sure it won't be that long until they are. But I don't think that would be the demise of plan sheets, necessarily.
The first time I provided a control network for a road project that used a digital model was about ten years ago. It was a hoot. The BIA inspectors were livid since they had no stakes with which to check the finished grade.
We finally settled (with a change-order for more money) with me providing 100' station offsets to cl hubs with a good elevation on them...Lord knows you couldn't trust the contractor to check his own grade!
I think the future is here, embrace it or step aside.
Some engineers around here will not release their cad files. Most cad files do not contain a surface model adequate for machine control.
Who is going to train all the designers on a proper machine control surface model and for which equipment?
"Some engineers around here will not release their cad files. "
Planning commissions are already requiring that submission, and in the future, they all will.
"Who is going to train all the designers on a proper machine control surface model and for which equipment?"
It will be the lawyers, as usual. They are our unknown best friends.
What are the standards for a surface model? I have seen some poor models passing as machine control worthy and that were far below MY standards.
Can't believe it frow where I sit.
I've got 4 "designers" who have P.E.'s and they JUST discovered
3D polylines this last couple of weeks.
Heck, I just talked management into FINALLY getting GPS here (only took 9 years).
They call all their "Plans" BID SETS..... typically difficult to even do a take off from.
I have access to their CAD files, and even I have to do the inhouse equivalent of and RFI to get enough data to set up staking for the contractors........
These "designers" are being taught that they are to "direct work" not DO work....
There is little danger of any 3D models coming from this place any decade soon...
Wonder what it'd be like working out there in the REAL world again....hmmmmmm
Whenever there is a significant savings of money, technology moves pretty durn fast. Those that don't keep up are soon out of business.
Money talks pretty loud.
> do you think this will happen? I think at least 15 years. I remember talking about this same subject 10 years ago from the machine control dealers (who at the time said 5-10 years).
>
> Extracted from this article about 3/4 ways down.
>
> "In the future—as designers gain more experience with modeling—the quality of modeling will increase, the comfort with delivering them as part of the project (not without being compensated handsomely I hope) will increase and they will become more common. At some point in time, a model will supersede the construction documents as a form of design documentation. Contractors will be required to construct the project based on a model, not on construction documents."
>
> I hope I placed this in the correct category. Please move if deemed necessary.
>
> Thad
Firm I was working for twenty years ago started a project for U.S. Army Corps of Engineers hand drafting survey control on mylars of aerial mapping. About three months into the project we were notified all future submissions, beginning in 45 days, would be 3D electronic mapping in Intergraph/MicroStation compatible files.
We were just beginning to locate all underground utilities in the project area. The files were also required to comply with Corps CADD standards we had never seen. We did not have that software in the company. Had one drafter in the firm that had worked in that software 3 or 4 years before. He had never worked in 3D or on a Corps project. We were able to comply but it was interesting for a while.
When this hits it will start on state and federal projects as Building Information Modeling transitions into civil practice. I have reason to believe it has already started. Autodesk Civil 3D has advertised it is BIM capable. If you look at the way it builds up highway section components the ability to create a grading plan is there. The planner just needs to document sub-grading beyond the pavement and later back fill to edge of pavement. The default models supplied with the 2010 software did not allow for this. Current or future versions or your own customization would allow for this.