http://javad.com/jgnss/javad/news/pr20151113.html
Comments anyone? Has anyone done this?
Um. Yes. I'm doing it. When you do it, Do the demo.
I got the demo, then bought 6 mos later.
I'd have been better off spending a weekend with a Javad man, learning, at the time of purchase.
Do it hands on. Don't try to figure it all out for yourself. You'll be romping in a week. It is DRASTICALLY different, than TDS and Carlson.
It is LITERALLY round earth technology. The individual jobs you do, are set up with Artificial barriers. Because EVERYTHING is done with the same core coord system. Lat Lon.
Nate
I have not YET done the mounting base on truck, but John Evers does it all the time. When you understand as much about it as I now do, it is a VERY simple matter to do that. PLUS you always have a check, through DPOS.
N
Seems like putting the base over a nail in the ground would have advantages over leaving it on the truck. Yes it saves setup with the truck.
But what if somebody gets in the truck to fetch something while you're out there with the rover? There went your vertical accuracy. Will wind shake the truck enough to matter?
And if you drive off for lunch or to come back the next day, doing a "here" on one of your points when you come back has doubled the variance of positions relative to the earlier sessions.
dmyhill, post: 350039, member: 1137 wrote: http://javad.com/jgnss/javad/news/pr20151113.html
Comments anyone? Has anyone done this?
I'm not sure what the point of the diagram is.
I've been putting my base on the truck for 20 years now.
There are lots of advantages to doing it.
But I'm not tied to a "remote" base, seems like a diagram that would work with or without a truck.
MightyMoe, post: 350161, member: 700 wrote: I'm not sure what the point of the diagram is.
I've been putting my base on the truck for 20 years now.
There are lots of advantages to doing it.
But I'm not tied to a "remote" base, seems like a diagram that would work with or without a truck.
Kind of your own version of a virtual base I suppose? Do you localize after each movement of the truck?
Nate The Surveyor, post: 350075, member: 291 wrote: Um. Yes. I'm doing it. When you do it, Do the demo.
I got the demo, then bought 6 mos later.
I'd have been better off spending a weekend with a Javad man, learning, at the time of purchase.
Do it hands on. Don't try to figure it all out for yourself. You'll be romping in a week. It is DRASTICALLY different, than TDS and Carlson.
It is LITERALLY round earth technology. The individual jobs you do, are set up with Artificial barriers. Because EVERYTHING is done with the same core coord system. Lat Lon.
Nate
I have tried it. They sent me a demo unit. I may not have given it the time it deserved. I asked for it at the start of winter, and it showed up in August. That is kind of my busy season, with football and the rainy season coming on. But, it was a free demo, and I really appreciated them sending it out.
When it first got here, everyone was pushing buttons, and very interested because of the unique form factor. But, then we all had work to do, and since it didn't play with the Total Stations, I just did some stuff with it on the weekends.
dmyhill, post: 350261, member: 1137 wrote: Kind of your own version of a virtual base I suppose? Do you localize after each movement of the truck?
I've never localized, I put it on the truck for security, either near people or livestock.......
I'm still not sure what they are accomplishing, I suppose it's to do with networks of which I've never had access to.
I will put it on the truck to keep it safer, only the gps antenna and radio antenna will be outside the truck, then your base will sitting locked up in the truck with the radio.
It's an old, old "trick" if you will, probably started with the first few RTK's.
But there will be an actual set control point nereby that I tie into, then reclac the base and restart it.
I suppose you might consider that localizing.
Mighty Moe,
You just described my reasons, and method exactly.
Cows and bad neighborhoods are not good for an un-attended base.
I would like to add that testing was done do determine any affects of entering and exiting the vehicle, and deliberate rocking. Basically the E-250 van always came back to the same position. Verified this with the robot.
My secondary reason is that the ground plane effect doubled my UHF radio range as compared to placing the exact same antenna 15 foot up on a mast.
John Evers, post: 350307, member: 467 wrote: Mighty Moe,
You just described my reasons, and method exactly.
Cows and bad neighborhoods are not good for an un-attended base.
I would like to add that testing was done do determine any affects of entering and exiting the vehicle, and deliberate rocking. Basically the E-250 van always came back to the same position. Verified this with the robot.
My secondary reason is that the ground plane effect doubled my UHF radio range as compared to placing the exact same antenna 15 foot up on a mast.
And, no I don't wish to carry around an electric fence,,,,,been there done that:)
MightyMoe, post: 350269, member: 700 wrote:
I suppose you might consider that localizing.
Yeah, I think that qualifies.
🙂
why not to put a total station on top of a truck and and traverse like that, occasionally shooting control points on the go,what a productivity!! 🙂 .
javad is trying to grab attention by stating somethis totally out out survey world, javad wants to be thought of as of survey mirracle. a survey triumph, a survey unthinkable PRARADIGM (their chip name).
i like the latest triumph, it looks like 80's panasonic stereo. They are good products i never tried, but i do not like when evil and good are glued and packaged together.
Yuriy,
I'm an OLD static, post processed, surveyor. L-1 only, if that matters. This concept is not only sound, but works well.
So you don't get confused. Here is data flow:
You have a REAL GPS control point, in the ground. Old Job. Has SPC, established on it's shiny top.
You have a JOB to do, near it. You don't want your GPS base to be meddled with. You PARK your car. Set the BASE GPS and Radio up, ON THE CAR.
You fire up all your gizmos. Your ROVER (Javad LS) and your BASE radio. And, your BASE GPS. You TELL the base it is on an autonomous point. You WALK to your control point. Occupy it. BACK the coord in, for the base. Return to base, and let the JAVAD LS tell the BASE, (Sitting, attached to car, with brakes locked) what it's coord is.
You survey the Lot.
You pack it up, and go to the office.
After GPS midnight, you process the DPOS. Says "Move N0å¡14'13"E 0.035", and UP 0.085' Adjust points? NO!
(This only serves as a double check, and the static session was not a long session)
You are HOLDING the coord on your RTK base station. It was established, with a much longer observation.
The above situation works with the GPS station 3 miles away too. (You HAVE to have 2 cars for this though).
You do it all identically, but you have to have another transport, to visit the GPS Control site. And, you occupy it longer. Maybe for 3 + minutes.
We are NOT driving around, with live good coords, on the base! This is just a security mechanism, for your base.
Got it?
Nate
Actually, with "Shift" you don't have to return to base, it applies the dX,dY,dZ shift to the rover position.
A localization will accomplish a similar result, but works differently. Localization translations apply to the projected coordinates dN, dE, dU (ie State Plane). Shift applies to the dX, dY, dZ ECEF geodetic coordinates. Both have distinct advantages and disadvantages. Shift applies to the Geodetic position (no fiction), Localizations apply to Grid projection coordinates (useful fiction). The disadvantage of a localization is that it does not accept modifications to the underlying geodetic position very well. (Although Javad's localization does update if a change in the geodetic position of the points used to create the localization is detected). The disadvantage of Shift is that it must be a relative small value (a few meters). Shifting from an autonomous position to a surveyed position is entirely acceptable. Shifting from a State Plane Coordinate to a 5000,5000 coordinate is not acceptable (this would represent a massive shift on a round surface). Localization can apply a translation of millions of meters because the grid values are just sliding around on a flat table top. The geodetics have already been done, now we're just playing with coordinates in a plane.
sorry, never heard of this method. You have strong wind and your truck (with all the brakes on) is moving say 12mm NE this second, 9mm E next second , 13 mm NE third second and so on - it is "oscilating" due to strong wind , and your javad RTK rover will account for that and you roves will always show say 5 mm accaracy ?
I would be trying this a lot before I trust it.
Yuriy Lutsyshyn, post: 351203, member: 2507 wrote: sorry, never heard of this method. You have strong wind and your truck (with all the brakes on) is moving say 12mm NE this second, 9mm E next second , 13 mm NE third second and so on - it is "oscilating" due to strong wind , and your javad RTK rover will account for that and you roves will always show say 5 mm accaracy ?
No. It doesn't work this way. Oscillations due to wind will affect accuracy. There's a time and a place for certain tools and strategies. And there's a time to leave those tools and strategies in the box.
Just in case, if it needs to be said, I'll go ahead and add that you should not use this technique with the car parked in the shade, under a canopy, while driving or while in a garage.
only one thing surprised me from the very beginning that soft truck rubber tires are supposed to work as stable as solid tripod all day long.
if you park on moist soil it will think, if temp changes as you work late night , and started your truck base at hot noon, the pressure will change in tires in the night due to tem change so base elavation changes, yo may have a bunch of cows scratching against you truck(this may apply for tripod too:)),truck - is just not stable platform for RTK base.
Yuriy Lutsyshyn, post: 351209, member: 2507 wrote: only one thing surprised me from the very beginning that soft truck rubber tires are supposed to work as stable as solid tripod all day long.
if you park on moist soil it will think, if temp changes as you work late night , and started your truck base at hot noon, the pressure will change in tires in the night due to tem change so base elavation changes, yo may have a bunch of cows scratching against you truck(this may apply for tripod too:)),truck - is just not stable platform for RTK base.
I will have no problem setting a pole and bipod for a static session, even for hours, but I wouldn't think of setting my robot on a rod and bipod. Nor would I think of setting it on a truck.
If the wind is blowing so hard that your truck is moving, then I'm wanting my base on the truck not on a tripod, even rocked or staked down it has a good chance of blowing over. In fact during high wind events I feel much better with on the truck.
I will use any tripod in my truck for a GPS base, but I want the best newest for my robot, tiny movements at the base during a GPS survey result in tiny movements at the rover, but those same movements during an instrument survey can get greatly magnified at the rod.
Different types of surveys requiring different techniques............
Always check, check, check, you will see any issues............
Honestly, I thought of the same issues, but after doing it for years, I just never, never found any kind of issue regarding accuracy using a truck base.
I've set the base on a rod, I've tied it to a fence post, mostly to keep it from being disturbed
Yuriy Lutsyshyn, post: 351203, member: 2507 wrote: sorry, never heard of this method. You have strong wind and your truck (with all the brakes on) is moving say 12mm NE this second, 9mm E next second , 13 mm NE third second and so on - it is "oscilating" due to strong wind , and your javad RTK rover will account for that and you roves will always show say 5 mm accaracy ?
I would be trying this a lot before I trust it.
Yuriy, there are exceptions to most rules. This is no exception. OK?
Tell us, do you use a Robot?
Do you use GPS?
RTK?
What brand?
Tell us a little about yourself.
There is more than one way to do most things. Even in the software. Pull down menu, or from the keyboard, or....
We are on this board to provide good information, and common sense solutions.
How may we help you?
Nate
I can say that I have had to build a fence from tpost and barbed wire around a control point and have hauled a hay ring out and anchor it down with screwin dog run anchorbolts around my base station because of pesky horse and cow in the field while the owner would not round up his critters into another pasture until the job was completed.
