The responses below that asked how far it was to the office got me thinking again about how the public views us. While I'm not about to say what is right and what is wrong, some of the descriptions of the office space make me cringe. If your clients see you in a less than professional space why should you expect to be treated like a professional?
I know that times are tough right now for many surveyors and we're all trying to watch expenses, but this may be the time that it is more important than ever to act professionally in every aspect of our lives.
So, my admontion is that if you want to be treated as a professional, be compensated as a professional, and be respected as a professional, then you had better be prepared to earn that respect. It doesn't come simply because you have passed some exam, put an LS after your name, and were permitted to create a CAD seal with you name in the middle.
Dave,
A lot of this has to do with the accepted norms for doing business in your community.
Within a half mile of my house/office there are doctors, dentists, attorneys, architects, engineers, accountants and land planners that work out of a home office.
In fact, because of the glut of telecommuters, many jurisdictions are rewriting their zoning regulations to remove restrictions on home occupations for professionals.
You mean that I can start using my early model mobile home for an office. Need to get a few more lodge poles and a bigger wrapper to make room, but not a huge problem.
jud
So I got to take down the stripper pole and kegerator out of the break room?
> So I got to take down the stripper pole and kegerator out of the break room?
You hiring?
The kegerator can stay, you just got to switch it to kegs of root beer.
I surveyed on my own for about 13 years now. I have a room in my home that looks like a professional office. I even have a separate door. In all those years, about five people walked through that door. Most of them were local neighbors who just show up in my driveway. If you conduct yourself professionally and appear as such, I think the average client doesn't care what your office circumstances are.
You're right, Dave. First thing tomorrow morning I'll go out and find an office building, buy a new truck, 4-wheeler, GPS/robot, hire office staff, and finally buy an new shiny car like you're standing next to so I can go out and "meet" clients and look real professional.
My business might fail overnight, but at least I'll look good going down!!
No, my stamp, work and product are what makes me who I am, not all the frickin stuff I have!!
Sorry, you really struck a nerve with your self-righteous attitude.
I have had several offices over the years. sometimes at home, sometimes not.
I never see most of my clients, unless they are out at the job site. Very rarely, and in the event I do have to meet a client face to face, I meet them at a restaurant or courthouse or a fast food joint.
I had a nice office recently. I figured since I was about to lose my house maybe I should move back home.
Pic of old office. (I miss it)
It was inside my store (which also failed for other reasons) and made to look like a house inside the store. I did get a door knob. I still have it and the door. They were displays for the store so we didn't leave them when we moved out. We sold many building products. Pretty much anything to do with building we sold.
Many are living at the bottom of the barrel. Professional image is the least of my worries at the moment. Not losing my house next month is. I might just end up LIVING IN A VAN DOWN BY THE RIVER! Chris Farley, gotta love him. 😀
Paying out an extra thousand or so a month for 'image' is not in my budget right at the moment.
I must go on about my office. The building was the old Trader Bank with cutstone siding and my file room was the bank vault. Awesome. I had a pretty large basement also off the door in my office. It was another 15X30 which was to be my private office in the future.
Another pic of a window.
(some vinyl I made for Mothers Day.)
I have a huge 'L' shaped desk with glass top also. It, in itself, DEMANDED Professional Respect. I had a full sized 'farm map' of Jackson County under the glass. It looked sweet! the desk was large enough for me to sleep under, which I did for a while when the wife kicked me out.;-) 😀
I have a pretty professional office space that I rent with a reception area, conference room, my personal office, drafting/plotting area, garage in back with dead truck and old files in it, etc. left over from when I had more than one office employee. Very few clients come in, it's usually all emails and phone calls, but when they do come in, I feel better having more than a king size bed as my office. But, I pay $1,690/mo. for it and for the use I get out of it, I might be better off just working off of my kitchen table. I don't know what I'd do with the 50 years worth of files, though. I hope I figure it out someday.
When I meet clients out on a job, I don't wear my Metallica t-shirt. Polo shirt and jeans mostly. Tomorrow I get to testify as an expert witness in a criminal trial against my client. Dockers and dress shirt, no tie.
That door gets today's gold star for cool factor.
The excuses are about what I expected. And now let's hear the complaining about low pay, no respect from clients or realtors, etc etc.
You don't have to spend $1000 a month for rent, but you do need to appear professional. If you have an office in your home, fine. But have an entrance so that clients don't have to go through the family living area where they trip over toys and dirty laundry.
It's not a self righteous thing - it's a fact of life.
Look at realtors - most have a nice office and very little complaint about 6% fees (or higher).
Look at doctors. Even if they have a home office, I guarantee it's not an extra bedroom down the hall that people have to walk through the living room to get to.
Look at lawyers. Even sole practitioners generally have an office, a waiting room, and a conference table / room.
Etc. Etc. Etc.
Say what you want, make all the excuses you want, but the public perceives us as we act. And that reflects the respect we get.
Dave - The thing is that realtors, doctors and lawyers don't crawl through swamps and cut brush as part of their job. I like to appear as though I could do those things when I'm at work. I have seen surveyors that dress up in slacks and ties and gold chains, but they don't look like they're ready to survey.
A truck that looks like it will make it to the job and back, equipment that looks like it hasn't been abused, those are the kinds of things I would invest in before office space because it's entirely possible to run a surveying business without clients even coming to your office space. If you work out of a place you don't feel comfortable meeting clients, go to their place or a neutral spot like a restaurant, then yeah go for a decent office when you can afford it but it's not worth going broke for.
> Look at realtors - most have a nice office and very little complaint about 6% fees (or higher).
Realtor SHARE office space around here Dave. I have a couple broker friends and they have many more realtors under them than they do desks. Most of the work done by realtors is from their home. At least around these parts. Maybe you live in a more upscale area or maybe you don't realize many realtors do work out of their homes. They only borrow space from their broker.
I don't have a broker to borrow space from.
All they see of me is the shirt soaked with sweat, spider webbed glasses, machete totin', tired guy walking back to the truck, with pants full of burs and hands full of dirt. Heck once in a while I'll have a spider on me crawling around somewhere. I seriously think spiders know where property lines are. And spiders TRY TO CATCH Surveyors. Stinkin spiders.
I NEVER have clients in my house. I meet them elsewhere. When I had the big office I ALMOST NEVER had clients come in. Maybe 10% would actually come in to my office.
Who is saying anthing about what you described? Have you had bad experience when you hired a surveyor or are you just assuming that's how it is with a home office?
My first not at home office had a full sized refridgerator filled with pop for the employees. And did I mention the beer? Two coffee makers. One for coffee and one for hot water to make hot chocolate or cider or cup-o-soups which I kept on hand for employees. I also had a full sized pool table in the break room with the fridge of pop and beer.
Employees tended to hang around at the end of the day for some reason. Had a lot of good times and it made the employees happy to come to work.
It was a medium size place with a front office, two side offices (one of which I used for a file room) and the break room.
I have worked from all sorts of offices. Those in high rise with a view, shared hallway and bath, construction hut, motel room, downtown storefront, office in front - living in back, frontage road with parking in rear, 12x12 with bath behind a hanging cloth, room in the corner of metal shop and now in spare bedroom.
Through all these location, I have actually seen maybe 10% of my clients in person at any of these places. I know them from meeting around in town, church, courthouse, bank, title company or some watering hole.
My main office is on the clients land.
If they have anything to complain about, it's not my office.
Who's making excuses? Many surveyors who have fancy offices and pretty secretaries who make sure the mint candy tray is full are now OUT OF WORK and have closed the oak doors. I'm quite content with my low overhead home office where I see the kids often and eat lunch with my family every day.
Clients come here about once a month; I'm almost always meeting them. The clients that do come here are generally contractors, etc that I have had a relationship with for many years. They care about the work I do, not if there's a daily newspaper they can read while my secretary waits to "let them in".
I have a good reputation and am proud of the work I do, and I didn't get there by having a high rent office. How's that an excuse?
Dave...
I agree with what you say...but it does seem that the left and right coast's have more of a need to have an office, than say those in the middle of the country...its not right of wrong its just what ever the local custom is.
Around here I'd say you wouldn't be considered to be on par with other professionals if you didn't have an office...of course others may feel differently.
Its NOT ABOUT YOUR WORK PRODUCT....its abut public perception. You work in mainly between you and your client, and while it does involve the 'public' the vast majority do not see your map...but the public does observe you while you are in the field....
Professionalism is a rounded product.
You could have a swanky down town office that looks more like a bordello! That does not grant a right of passage to professionalism.
33 years ago I realized that my work place was in the main the client's property.
I originally started with a dedicated room as the working office and actually never had a meeting at my place, always meeting on site or at client's office.
Clients want you to efficiently deliver a product for a fair price. There is a misunderstanding in the view of potential clients and many surveyors as to what is a fair price !
Clients do not appreciate what is involved in producing the desired outcome.
The fee situation is further exacerbated by the fact that many surveyors undercharge in an endeavor to simply win the job.
If they win the job and satisfactorily deliver the product then they can be seen as Professional whether they work from home or not.
If they win the job and do not deliver the product with satisfaction, instead reducing their costs by cutting corners and even if working from an office then their action is prostitution .
RADU
There is what is right for you and there is what is right for me. They do not need to be identical.
I could buy a new Hummer and outfit it as a survey chariot. That would not be viewed as a positive statement about my business practices by the vast majority of my clients. They have no desire to fund my extravagances.
