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How Temporary is "Temporary"?

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(@jim-frame)
Posts: 7277
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t

There's no language on the map indicating an expiration date, nor any reference to a recorded document that might include same.

 
Posted : 01/10/2020 6:37 pm
(@bill93)
Posts: 9834
 

A good one for the l*wyers to argue over, not surveyors. Very poor practice to grant that one.

Perhaps if the easement wasn't used for some period of time, evidencing that it was no longer needed, so the temporary period had elapsed, it could be ruled as extinguished? As opposed to a utility easement that may continue unused for possible future use.

 
Posted : 01/10/2020 7:17 pm
(@flga-2-2-2-2-2-2-2-2)
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@bill93

The Attorneys involved will be able to buy that new jet theyƒ??ve always wanted. ?????ÿ

 
Posted : 02/10/2020 4:05 am
(@aliquot)
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Bad practice, but you will generally find the consensus is that either there were specific circumstances at the time of platting that required the easement, which means the easement expires when the conditions change, or that it expires after abandonment. Of course the trial courts are unpredictable, so your mileage may vary if it goes to court.

This looks like a modern plat. There are a lot of us that are not the sharpest pencils in the box.?ÿ

 
Posted : 02/10/2020 5:23 am
(@stlsurveyor)
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State of Minnesota 505.021 sub. 7,?ÿ says, "Temporary easements, building setback information, and building floor elevations shall not be shown on a plat".

Learned that while studying. I think it is a great thing.?ÿ

 
Posted : 02/10/2020 6:02 am
(@thebionicman)
Posts: 4437
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Hopefully there is a separate recorded document creating the reservation. More than once I've seen surveyors neglect to include that information on maps...

 
Posted : 02/10/2020 6:24 am
(@norman-oklahoma)
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@aliquot

There is a need to look at the conditions on the ground, both now and at the time of platting. If Parcel 2 now has an alternative access that did not exist at the time of platting that would be a strong argument that "temporary" has run it's course.?ÿ ?ÿ

 
Posted : 02/10/2020 7:57 am
(@brian-allen)
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Is this a subdivision plat or a survey??ÿ

If this is only a survey and not a subdivision, without a separate document creating an express?ÿeasement, there is a good chance the easement was never created.

 
Posted : 02/10/2020 8:26 am
(@jim-frame)
Posts: 7277
Topic starter
 

Subdivision.?ÿ A Parcel Map, in California parlance (4 lots or fewer).?ÿ Done in 2006 by a usually reputable engineering/surveying firm.

 
Posted : 02/10/2020 10:54 am
 jph
(@jph)
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@brian-allen

I agree, depending on the state, the plan just maps it out, but doesn't create anything till papers are passed.

 
Posted : 08/10/2020 5:47 am
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25292
 

Without a related, recorded document providing the details to the whole world, it never happened.............here.?ÿ Your mileage may vary.

 
Posted : 08/10/2020 5:54 am
(@jim-frame)
Posts: 7277
Topic starter
 

In CA a filed Parcel Map imparts constructive notice, same as a recorded document.?ÿ (Not so for a Record of Survey.)

 
Posted : 08/10/2020 7:27 am
(@mike-marks)
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Posted by: @jim-frame

In CA a filed Parcel Map imparts constructive notice, same as a recorded document.?ÿ (Not so for a Record of Survey.)

It's because an ROS cannot subdivide, it's merely a Record of existing conditions, although profound because an LS attests to it.?ÿ Required in many non-subdividing transactions, most notably Lot Line Adjustments, and when there's a discrepancy with the record and/or new monuments are set in substantially different location(s) although I'd argue Corner Records suffice if there's no substantial discrepancies.

Sorry to thread drift but concerning the wacky world of LLA's in Cali' this court cite is worth 20 minutes of your time.?ÿ In the late '80s I did a simultaneous LLA involving 30 parcels to convert an equestrian subdivision into McMansion lots which were more lucrative.?ÿ Same # of parcels, bigger and the surrounding equestrian (horse trail) lot was reduced to a 5' strip.?ÿ The County was aghast but had no defense.?ÿ Now that the 4 lot rule is in effect it can't be done?ÿ without dozens of sequential LLSs which would take years.

Appeal Court

?ÿ

 
Posted : 08/10/2020 12:57 pm
(@aliquot)
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@holy-cow

Granting or reserving easements by subdivision plat is very common in many states. It reduces the likelihood of the easement being lost from the chan of title to near zero.?ÿ

 
Posted : 08/10/2020 1:37 pm
(@holy-cow)
Posts: 25292
 

@aliquot

That is true.?ÿ But, until Jim's clarifying post this morning, it might have simply been drawn on a standard survey.?ÿ On a standard survey it means nothing.?ÿ It is similar to a proposed easement.?ÿ We can show one on our survey plat but it means nothing without a recorded document actually creating it.

 
Posted : 08/10/2020 4:11 pm
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