I was talking to friend of mine in California that works on a lot of ALTA surveys and he told me that most of the ALTA surveys do not require corners to be set. He said the reason was that if a new corner was set, that would trigger having to do a "Record Survey" that can take up to a year to get filed with the county.
What is this "Record Survey" and why does it take so long to get filed?
I have never had it take a year to get a Record of Survey through map check.
A Record of Survey is an 18"x26" map that is filed by the Surveyor and checked by the County Surveyor. Once checking is complete and the surveyor delivers the signed mylar it is filed at the County Recorder's office. The current requirements have been in place since the early 20th century and there were filing requirements beginning with the original 1892 Land Surveyor's Act.
Usually it takes a day to a week to draft (depending on how large the survey is) then the County Surveyor has 20 days to check it. 99% of time my second submittal is the signed mylar.
There are several triggers. ALTA surveys can trigger the requirement even if monuments are not set.
You can look at some examples at this link:
http://sacmaps.com/
What does the County Surveyor check?
It's called a Record of Survey. Depending on the County Surveyor, as much or as little is checked as they think is needed to sign this:
> He said the reason was that if a new corner was set, that would trigger having to do a "Record Survey" that can take up to a year to get filed with the county.
If he really believes that, he's either incompetent or negligent.
There's more than a smattering of licensees who don't really believe it, but say it anyway to convince themselves that they're not violating statute law. They're the reason most ALTAs in California are done for disgustingly low fees.
What are the fees like? I heard some bad stories, don't know if I believe them (like fees more than the survey cost in LA).
> What are the fees like? I heard some bad stories, don't know if I believe them (like fees more than the survey cost in LA).
Recording fees for the Portland area counties are around $400.
> > He said the reason was that if a new corner was set, that would trigger having to do a "Record Survey" that can take up to a year to get filed with the county.
That is the trigger in Oregon. Setting of a monument.
I'm with Jim Frame on this. I used to think that setting a monument was the main trigger for record of surveys. Not anymore. If you establish a property line (show in relation to physical features, dimension, set a setback stake, etc.) and that line is not shown on a recorded map, THEN YOU MUST DO A RECORD OF SURVEY. I believe that is the letter of the law per the PLS Act.
Jim's spot on although it reeks more of incomptence than negligence. Its disheartening how many licensees don't fully comprehend their State's licensing laws.
I'm sure that is so in California. But in Oregon the wording of the law is quite clear.
ORS 209.250 Survey by registered land surveyor; requirements for map, narrative or report of survey; waiver of required filing; effect of noncompliance. (1) A registered professional land surveyor making a survey of lands within this state wherein the surveyor establishes or reestablishes a boundary monument shall, within 45 days thereafter, submit for filing a permanent map of the survey to the county surveyor for review......
The law in Washington is less clear. It says you must file when a corner is established. I suppose you could establish a corner without setting a monument. But I think the writer's intent was to equate corner and monument.
Filing fees in my county are $20. There is no review, they put the map in the file and start selling copies for $4. I see a lot of surveys that I think have problems but I'm not sure I want reviews if the costs go way up. What happens if the reviewer decides your boundary determination is wrong? Can they make you change it? Opinions vary sometimes and when it comes to most governments they have the last word.
I know Salt Lake County does some review of surveys. I haven't done one there for a decade or so. I remember one where they rejected it because we hadn't listed a monument as "found." It was one of there own street monuments and we just showed it with the measurements. When I went into the office I just took a pen and wrote "found" on the Mylar and they accepted it.
Utah law says that they can only charge filing fees for Records of Survey if the money is used for corner perpetuation. This requires a county ordinance and a special fund established to put the money into. So the county surveyor can't charge for review time to cover the cost for the review. But the law doesn't limit the filing fee so they could make it $1000 if they chose. If they did make it large the county commissioners would likely hear from some voters. Interestingly, my county has never passed the ordinance but they charge a $20 filing fee, something I intend to ask the county commission about.
> They're the reason most ALTAs in California are done for disgustingly low fees.
I guess all is relative. The typical prices he was talking about were only ones we could dream about in Florida. Around here it seems ALTAs aren't considered much more than a glorified mortgage survey (if you do them at all).
