We have had an SX10 since April. Ours is a small firm, one or two field crews. I have used it for boundary and topo and staking. It is heavy. I would not want to carry one through the woods or up a mountain though it has the same backpack hard case as the S6. For town work, it is a phenomenal tool. Never had a day where the battery didn't last. I don't have to go into intersections or highways anymore to shoot stripes and manhole lids (ours has never chased tail lights or locked on anything but the prism in heavy traffic). We don't do ALTA surveys but some of our topo surveys are close to that level of detail and it is certainly a fieldwork time saver. Best of all, it gets everything, even the shots I don't think we need so when the engineers pop up and say "Oh I forgot we need this too" then we don't have to make three trips back to the site for remnants. Our long range goal is to train the engineering techs to extract the points out of the clouds themselves (TBC has some pretty slick routines for this purpose and I'm exploring other software solutions as well) so we surveyors can focus on mass data collection and boundary resolution and let them get their own data out of the field files. We have to learn it first though and so far we certainly spend more time drafting than we did but the field time savings are substantial and our field time costs more than office time.
Our firm does not own a scanner so it was a good bridge for us to learn the workflow and processing techniques in case we want to move into that market.
We also have a Topcon tablet (Juniper) and both work well (though the Trimble is heavier and technologically clunkier than the Juniper device -- It runs on Windows 7 and it is rugged and has big batteries but it is a bit awkward all around while the Juniper tablet is lean and mean, also has plenty of battery life and suprisingly both work well under adverse conditions). Robotic radio range is about 1000' so far, for shots any further than that then you will have to go back and stand closer to the instrument.
All in all the SX10 is a great tool, powerful, fast, simple to use and certainly a game changer for our firm in terms of field efficiency and capability. I like being able to carry it on all the jobs, even the ones where we don't really need it. Price is high (ours was $60k including all of the software, we had zero Trimble experience) but Trimble offered 0% financing and I believe it will pay for itself pretty quickly. One of my buddies bought one as well and he seems satisfied with it.
The company my son works for just got one and he LOVES it!
.jpg "JAKEANDSX10 (480x640).jpg")
He was using it yesterday to scan this junkie yard.
I asked him about the eye hazard; he said he wasn't going to run any tests. you'll need to refer to the manufacturer.
He said it's really accurate; he took several check shots and everything matched.
Dougie
Lee D, post: 441186, member: 7971 wrote: All of this information can be found on the spec sheet which is easily obtained from Trimble's web site.
While not trying to be a smart alec, I know what the specs say, but also know real world experience is something all together different. I'm looking for experiential information, not spec sheet information.
McRey, post: 441039, member: 12937 wrote: Can anyone provide me with any information about the accuracy of the SX10 scans, or the safety of the laser...is it eye safe, etc?
I don't know about the safety of the laser. I can't see it and I haven't tried to look inside while it is moving. The scan points appear to be as accurate as any other RL solution. The camera frequently takes pictures of us standing around talking while it is collecting data and I foresee that as being a potential occupational hazard
Lee D, post: 441190, member: 7971 wrote:
I also enjoy being able to sit in an air conditioned vehicle in Louisiana in August while I shoot reflectorless topo to power lines, etc. I've operated the SX10 from the comfort of my vehicle more than once.
That is really appealing also for our cold winters here when there are a few hundred reflector-less shots to be taken.
Lee D, post: 441190, member: 7971 wrote:
Regarding "real" scanners... do you really need a 360 degree full dome scan at every setup, and the 50,000,000+ points that come with it?
Yes I do for the large internal building scans I do with subsequent cloud to cloud registration.
Totalsurv, post: 441246, member: 8202 wrote: Yes I do for the large internal building scans I do with subsequent cloud to cloud registration.
Then you need, and undoubtedly have, a big boy scanner. We don't have a scanner and have never felt we needed one, but the SX10 is a good entr??e into the market. If I ever need to do something like you're describing I'll go rent a TX8.
What's the maintenance regime for scanning guns like the SX-10 and the MS60? They're so jam-packed with motors and mirrors and sensors that I wonder if they require more frequent (and expensive!) shop time than a conventional robot.
McRey, post: 441227, member: 12937 wrote: While not trying to be a smart alec, I know what the specs say, but also know real world experience is something all together different. I'm looking for experiential information, not spec sheet information.
Supposedly the accuracy of the scans is the same as the accuracy of the reflectorless shots, which is part of the appeal. As I understand it the scanning uses the same beam with a spinning mirror such as what dedicated scanners use. From my experience, this is born out by the results I've seen. The data isn't noisy or fuzzy, and when the instrument is resected from the same control points at each setup the scans align beautifully without the need for any registration.
As far as eye safety, I'm going to go out on a limb and say what Trimble states on the spec sheet is reliable. And in any case I have no future plans of staring down the barrel.
Jim Frame, post: 441259, member: 10 wrote: What's the maintenance regime for scanning guns like the SX-10 and the MS60? They're so jam-packed with motors and mirrors and sensors that I wonder if they require more frequent (and expensive!) shop time than a conventional robot.
That's a good point; I guess we're fixing to find out. Another good point is will our local dealer be able to fully support it or will it have to go to Trimble for any repairs? Typically Trimble wants all failed instruments to come back to them for the first six months to a year after a new product is introduced so that they can identify their problems and create engineering fixes for them.
Just to update this - the one thing I miss from using an S6 is the MT1000. The SX10 only has passive tracking, and you have to be very careful about making sure you're locked onto the prism. I had two incidents last week where I took shots on something other than my prism; on the first I crossed my backsight and took ten shots to it while cross sectioning a road. Luckily we didn't really need those points, because I didn't catch it in the field. The second time I was foresighting a point where I wanted to set up and take a scan; when I set up on it and backsighted I was 31 feet off. In that instance I shot direct and reverse to my backsight prism to get a good distance and delta height, then took the average of two VRS observed control points after the scan was complete to get azimuth. That was easier than re-occupying the first point.
I've had incredibly good results using Integrated Surveying to resect the instrument in; that's just wayyyy too easy. And something I inadvertently discovered last week that is way cool is that if you leave the R10 on the prism you still see the E-bubble even when topoing with the SX10. What this means is that I can put the EDM in tracking, give the rod to the other crew member, and just hit Store on the Tablet when the bubble goes green. This would of course be true with any Trimble robot using an R10 for IS but it made getting topo around a building a breeze.
The ability to switch from reflectorless to robotic to scanning to RTK, and have the RTK and robot interact in real time is extremely powerful. Other than the above mentioned passive tracking issues, the SX10 has been a great gun so far.
Lee D, post: 447619, member: 7971 wrote: I was foresighting a point where I wanted to set up and take a scan; when I set up on it and backsighted I was 31 feet off. In that instance I shot direct and reverse to my backsight prism to get a good distance and delta height, then took the average of two VRS observed control points after the scan was complete to get azimuth.
Do you have any idea what it took the shot on? I've sat on the side of the highway all day and never seen it lock on to anything but the prism it sort of blew my mind that it didn't wander. I can't get mine to take a shot without locking on a prism (maybe the autolock toggle). Monday we were trying to shoot a peanut prism that was too far and we could see the yellow pole and the orange on the prism but couldn't get it to measure. I finally went and found a bigger prism and put it on to get the shot. Distance was 980 feet
I wonder if it would be technically unfeasible for Trimble to give active tracking to the SX10.
I don't know what it was but I'm assuming it was a tail light. I was set up on a sidewalk about 6 feet from the curb and the foresight was straight down the sidewalk; when I looked at the azimuth delta it was to the road side of the prism.
My dealer said that Trimble says there's not room for it, but I'm sure that if it's possible they'll figure out a way.
It was my last setup, I was hot and tired and sore (summer decided to make a cameo appearance), and I got lazy. But I learned from it and you can bet I'll never shoot a foresight again without zooming in tight enough to make sure of what I'm aimed at.
