There is a sense of satisfaction when you can provide a service to people. However, when the service is basically "fixing" a mess someone else created then it's not as much fun.
I have a house in a 1970's era subdivision. New FEMA maps were issued, and a Zone A just clips the house. The thing about that is the Zone A is clearly following the blue GIS line and not the actual stream. It's about 60 feet wide centered more or less on that blue line, at the client's house it moves away?ÿfrom the actual stream towards the house and guess what; the zone touches the house. My client's house is the last house on this Zone A, as you move upstream it just ends. There is all of 5 sq.mi. of drainage for this stream which doesn't even run all year. If the house would be under water the bottom of a?ÿhill 1200' on the opposite side of the stream would need to be getting wet. As the "flood plain" shown as Zone A heads downstream it at times leaves the actual stream, and in a couple of places the blue line representing the stream goes through actual houses. What a total cluster.
My client is paying thousands a year for this and now will have to pay an engineer to get a BFE and us to do cross sections and file the paperwork. That won't be cheap either. Hopefully, he can get some of the insurance money back. There is no reason for this; either do a professional job when you put out an engineering product or go wash cars or flip burgers for a living.
You don't understand how government works, or doesn't work. The more money FEMA requires, the more residence that fall under flood hazards. Don't worry, just play their game.?ÿ Let FEMA do the work before you spend money on an engineer.?ÿ Don't get in a hurry, send them lots of digital paperwork and involve the county.?ÿ Think like them, but don't be like them.
You don't understand how government works, or doesn't work. The more money FEMA requires, the more residence that fall under flood hazards. Don't worry, just play their game.?ÿ Let FEMA do the work before you spend money on an engineer.?ÿ Don't get in a hurry, send them lots of digital paperwork and involve the county.?ÿ Think like them, but don't be like them.
Let FEMA do what work? They won't do anything about any of it.
It's up to the homeowner out here. They get to do the BFE and pay the fees, the last one we did was on a bigger river, cost was over 5k, but he was happy, got flood insurance off his back.
While I know that some will scoff at the idea, I have had success in the past with requesting that FEMA determines a BFE for a LOMA application. I send them all the paperwork (Elev. Cert., MT-EZ, etc.) and a letter saying I have checked with the proper authorities, no alternate sources of BFE are available, and so would they kindly determine it at the location. This can be effective when dealing with ridiculously out of whack Zone A's such as you have described.?ÿ
From a NFIP Guidance Document:
"What if no BFEs have been Determined?
In some instances, BFEs for a certain SFHA have not yet
been determined. FEMA will attempt to calculate the BFE
when a LOMA application is submitted for properties of
less than 50 lots or 5 acres. Sometimes, a BFE can be
developed from sources such as U.S. Geological Survey
topographic quadrangle maps. If that information is not
available, the property owner will be asked to supply a
survey for the property with the information necessary to
allow FEMA to develop a site-specific BFE. National Flood
Insurance Program (NFIP) regulations require that the
requester determine the BFEs for properties larger than 50
lots or 5 acres. A variety of computational methods can be
employed to determine BFEs, but these methods can be
expensive. Before computational methods are used, every
attempt should be made to obtain information, in the form
of floodplain studies or previous computations, from
Federal, State, or local agencies. Data obtained from these
agencies may be adequate to determine BFEs with little or
no additional research, calculation, or cost."
While I know that some will scoff at the idea, I have had success in the past with requesting that FEMA determines a BFE for a LOMA application. I send them all the paperwork (Elev. Cert., MT-EZ, etc.) and a letter saying I have checked with the proper authorities, no alternate sources of BFE are available, and so would they kindly determine it at the location. This can be effective when dealing with ridiculously out of whack Zone A's such as you have described.?ÿ
From a NFIP Guidance Document:
"What if no BFEs have been Determined?
In some instances, BFEs for a certain SFHA have not yet
been determined. FEMA will attempt to calculate the BFE
when a LOMA application is submitted for properties of
less than 50 lots or 5 acres. Sometimes, a BFE can be
developed from sources such as U.S. Geological Survey
topographic quadrangle maps. If that information is not
available, the property owner will be asked to supply a
survey for the property with the information necessary to
allow FEMA to develop a site-specific BFE. National Flood
Insurance Program (NFIP) regulations require that the
requester determine the BFEs for properties larger than 50
lots or 5 acres. A variety of computational methods can be
employed to determine BFEs, but these methods can be
expensive. Before computational methods are used, every
attempt should be made to obtain information, in the form
of floodplain studies or previous computations, from
Federal, State, or local agencies. Data obtained from these
agencies may be adequate to determine BFEs with little or
no additional research, calculation, or cost."
There a couple of issues with doing that.
We have tried it and been rejected by FEMA in this area, but think about this, just how would they get the data to calculate a real BFE. There is only one way, the same way the zone AEs were done and that's boots on the ground collecting cross-sections, acquiring profile info, there is no data base with that data that I know of that could give an accurate number.
So at the end of the day could you trust the #? You could end up putting the house in the flood way when it really isn't. So you end up with a bigger survey, the reason I know this is cause we are doing just that; disputing FEMA maps in a community in the county. And that has been very expensive.
You can always try the "if you can't beat 'em, then join 'em" approach. Even thought the house doesn't flood (most houses at the edge of an unnumbered A Zone don't) Just have your client install unneeded flood vents, at least his flood insurance will go from thousands to a half.
Moe,
I agree it shouldn't be up to the homeowner to bear the brunt of the expense for correcting the problem with the map, but that is just what we are faced with. What I've found which helps, run a cross section from the house?ÿ to the stream, showing how far it is, using other maps to show how far away it is, then submit for a LOMA. Make sure you include a letter explaining the situation. The last one I did had the stream running through the house but in reality was 90'+/- to the south?ÿwhich was also the surveyed boundary so I included the recorded survey.
