It was mentioned in a thread below that if Kristi had anything to tell folks over here she should post here herself. As odd as that might seem, I think her posting here and perhaps giving some recognition to reality, would be a very classy thing to do.
POB has provided us with a place to meet and mingle for a long time now and they are still the "keepers of the archives". POB needs readers (and people to hit their site), and not just any readers, but readers from the surveying community whom their advertisers wish to target. It makes no sense for POB to further alienate anyone and repairing some obviously damaged relationships might be in order.
I still believe that their best move would be to get on the phone to Wendell and do their best to convince him to cross link this site and POB's new site (place links to other on each one) and create some kind of relationship between the two that could greatly improve the new POB sites stats, which are what their advertising rates are going to be based upon.
I do not believe for a moment that anyone here is hostile towards Kristi and I reall believe that she would be well received here, and that it would be a good move for POB for her to take that step to reach out while it can still make a difference. I hope she is reading this board and will consider what I am suggesting. We've all had a long relationship with POB and with her. It would be a shame to let that relationship go sour over a few misteps and misunderstandings.
Bob Manley, PLS
I agree, Bob. I think both sites have something to offer, and we should be grateful for the resources.
The accusations I have read about Kristi are over the top, and unwarranted.
Bob, I have to respectfully disagree
:cat:
I agree, Kristi is just an employee of a much larger than POB publishing company.
I am disappointed by some of the personal attacks.:bad:
Dan
Kristi is a big girl. She is not a secretary who gets coffee for the board meetings, she is the Editor of POB.
You may think my comments were a personal attack..Nope, I was expressing how I see the whole situation without any candy coating.
It is not about hating Kristi. It is about the organization that she is an editor for not listening. And then coming up with excuses. They screwed up. From their board "The longstanding No. 1 message board for land surveyors, RPLS.com, has undergone a radical transformation to bring you new tools that can help you succeed in the rapidly changing geomatics profession" and that is most definitely true. But it was a radical transformation that soooo many said they did not like and did not want! And as the editor of their mag and the Administrator of RPLS, she is ultimately responsible for this move. She, or her team, missed it. They dropped the ball on the change, they thought that people would hate it at first and then grow to love it, they thought we would all just do what they wanted and they were wrong. Much like how drinkers of Coke did not like it when the company made such a drastic change. Was the New Coke horrible, probably not as I remember that a lot of people admitted they could not taste the difference. But the customers did not like it. And it ended up being a fiasco. Kristi, rather than admitting the site was not ready, launched the site a day after the promised date and now is offering excuses for the slow speed. She just needs to admit that they messed up. And she, as the boss, needs to admit she underestimated reaction against the site. But to blow it off like she has just is an insult.
One more thing: how many of you, as the boss would accept an employee, after you promised a customer that a survey would be ready by such and such date, to not have it ready and just blow off the date. Or would you want an explanation for why they did not have the survey ready because it makes you look bad in front of your client.
Georgia..
or worse yet...Ignoring the client and their concerns..
Georgia..
Some think this is about attacking Kristi, it is not. It is about holding her feet to the fire for actions that she, as the Administrator of the site and the editor of POB, chose to pursue. She made promises: promises to listen to feedback, promises of a changeover date, and she failed to follow through. Why is it not OK to point that out and demand an explanation?
Georgia..
Posters are not the client, the advertises are.
The message board was/is a free service.
I think Kristi was just trying to do the job she was given, seems like Dan Murfey could share some of that blame.
Sure, it's a little slow, maybe not as easy to navigate as this site, and maybe a little less than perfect right now but I don't have any huge gripes about it. OK, so they were less than ready at the switch over. I'll still visit and post there. It's just a god damn message board and it's not a huge deal to me.
Georgia..
I think the point is moot now, don't you? this is where were where we are at because of those actions, lets make this work
:cat:
actually they have two clients
first the advertisers: they promised them readers of their ads. But if you alienate those readers, that alienation may cost the advertisers clients. So ticking off the readers is failing those clients.
Second the readers: if you do not have readers, then you do not have advertisers. So anything they release is meant to get the interest of those readers so that they stay loyal to the brand and buy Seco rods because POB advertises them. But if you say that you will listen to suggestions of those clients and don't do it, you have just damaged that relationship with those clients and it can cause them to say "I will not buy South Instruments because POB advertises them and POB is unreliable".
actually they have two clients
I guess.
Follow the Money
Dan is correct.
POB is not driven by the surveying profession; it is trying to drive the surveying profession. POB is an organ for equipment and software manufacturers and those people have decided that there is a far greater market for their products if they can just get surveyors marginalized and out of the way. The broader "geomatics" category is seen as a huge market and surveyors cannot be allowed to be the lead profession.
Stay tuned for further non-developments.
Follow the Money
The broader "geomatics" category is seen as a huge market...
Care to expand your thoughts on this?
Follow the Money
Well, it's almost too simple to explain.
The surveying equipment manufacturers do not want to see their products limited to "surveyors" anymore. I'm retired from one of them. There is a far larger market in the broader "geomatics" category and you will find the manufacturers arrayed against any surveyors or groups of surveyors who try to legally define surveying as anything but boundary surveying.
But perhaps you know of a surveying instrument manufacturer who didn't line up as a "friend of the court" against the ACSM a few years ago (2007) in the MAPPS lawsuit.
If so, we'd like to know who it is.
I cannot and will not say anything bad about Kristi because: 1.) I don't really know her; 2.) She seems like a really nice person; and 3.) I think her heart is in the right place.
Nor will you find me bashing her or POB here. I have offered my opinions at the old and new sites and intended it purely as constructive criticism -- no less, no more. I wish her and POB no ill will whatsoever.
As I've said before, I've been trying to start a surveyor's forum for several years, but none of them ever took off. It was not until I truly listened to the people and acted on their criticisms and suggestions that I finally found the mark.
I'm really avoiding these types of threads for the most part, but just thought I should at least pop in here and let you know where I am coming from.
I still say that for POB to reach out at this point and make some gesture to show that they understand the reality of the situation would be a classy thing for them to do, that this would be good business for them and that we would do well to be receptive to such a gesture. They've lost the forum, that seems clear enough...but there is still a possibility to repair some of the damage...and avert a lot of hard feelings. Hard feelings that could see a lot of people dropping their "free" subscriptions to the paper POB mag...I think what has just occurred is far more serious for POB and its future than what many people, including those at POB, believe at this point.
Yes it’s just a message board, but for POB this is their target audience. We are, at the end of the day, their raison d'etre. Without us, what do they have? A potentially lucrative market among GIS pro's? How many total stations, rtk systems and CAD packages are they going to buy? Who are POB's major advertisers? Look at the adverts in the mag...They are firms marketing SURVEY EQUIPMENT!
If I were in Kristi's shoes, I'd be thinking about what I could do to reach out to folks right now...Besides I don't want to see Mike Binge lose his part-time gig with POB. 😉
Wendell, in the past starting a surveyors forum was going to be tough because rpls was so popular...When POB essentially cast aside that successful format (in favor of a format that is clearly not ready for prime time) in the face of a very significant level of opposition from the community, this created an opening...An opening for which you have created a nearly perfect vehicle.
This is straight out of free market entrepreneurship 101. There was an unmet demand and you stepped in to satisfy that demand, and for that we are all extremely grateful. I have thought for a long time that it would be much better if the surveyor’s forum was actually owned and operated by someone from our community rather than a large corporate entity. People have for years now remembered Mark Deal and thanked him for what he created for us...and from now on you will always be remembered in this community as the guy who gave us Beerleg.com. We are an opinionated and often ornery group, but we are also the kind of folks who recognize and appreciate the contributions of others, and your contribution is substantial and I believe it will be enduring.
My comments are not about you or this site so much as they are about POB and the magnitude of the disaster they have created for themselves. I firmly believe that Beerleg.com is here to stay. Thanks
Bob
