Survey

  • Posted by Ozarkbuilder on August 11, 2022 at 9:05 pm

    Can anyone give me an idea where the line would be that splits this 10 acre tract into a 7 and 3 acre tracts? I want the beginning to start 30′ to the left of the concrete r/w monument on state route A and go to the back line. The measurement from the r/w monument to the pin on the left side of the 308.30 line on the back is 575′ if that helps. Thanks.

    Ozarkbuilder replied 1 year, 9 months ago 17 Members · 57 Replies
  • 57 Replies
  • Ozarkbuilder

    Ozarkbuilder

    Member
    August 11, 2022 at 9:12 pm

    The 7 acre tract being on the left side.

  • bill93

    bill93

    Member
    August 11, 2022 at 10:18 pm

    If you are buying g or selling a portion of the 10 acres, don’t you need the services of a licensed surveyor on site to monument it and supply a plat? I don’t see that an answer here will be of much help. Someone here with CAD tools could whip out an answer, but then what?

     


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  • Norman_Oklahoma

    Norman_Oklahoma

    Member
    August 11, 2022 at 10:20 pm
    Posted by: @ozarkbuilder

    Can anyone give me an idea where the line would be that splits this 10 acre tract into a 7 and 3 acre tracts?

    A land surveyor licensed to practice in your area can handle that.  

    Posted by: @ozarkbuilder

    The measurement from the r/w monument to the pin on the left side of the 308.30 line on the back is 575′ if that helps.

    Actually, it should be 560.65′.  

  • bill93

    bill93

    Member
    August 11, 2022 at 10:33 pm
    Posted by: @norman-oklahoma
    Posted by: @ozarkbuilder

     575′ if that helps.

    Actually, it should be 560.65′.  

    Which demonstrates the need for an on-site surveyor to confirm the dimensions and produce an accurate result.


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  • Norman_Oklahoma

    Norman_Oklahoma

    Member
    August 11, 2022 at 10:44 pm
    Posted by: @bill93

    Which demonstrates the need for an on-site surveyor to confirm the dimensions and produce an accurate result.

    In that part of the world the fee will be around $1000 and save many times that in future litigation. 

  • dave-lindell

    dave-lindell

    Member
    August 11, 2022 at 10:55 pm

    @norman-oklahoma :  Surveys are a grand.  Litigation is hundreds of grand.

  • Ozarkbuilder

    Ozarkbuilder

    Member
    August 11, 2022 at 11:22 pm

    All of you are correct. The outside of this property has all been marked in the last week by a surveyor that is going off this survey that is filed in the recorder of deeds office. I’m waiting for them to give me a price/call back but not much happens soon in this area. I can move the front line on the highway where I want but I want the small pasture and barn on the 7 acres and that is about the front corner of the pasture. I was just wondering about where I would be on the back line. Thanks.

  • Ozarkbuilder

    Ozarkbuilder

    Member
    August 11, 2022 at 11:45 pm
    Posted by: @norman-oklahoma
    Posted by: @ozarkbuilder

    Can anyone give me an idea where the line would be that splits this 10 acre tract into a 7 and 3 acre tracts?

    A land surveyor licensed to practice in your area can handle that.  

    Posted by: @ozarkbuilder

    The measurement from the r/w monument to the pin on the left side of the 308.30 line on the back is 575′ if that helps.

    Actually, it should be 560.65′.  

    Not bad….I measured that with a 30′ DeWalt tape off the survey.

  • nate-the-surveyor

    nate-the-surveyor

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 1:22 am

    My recommendation is to contact the surveyor who generated that plat.

    He’s already got a file going on it.

    We run into many surveys/descriptions, that are precisely what you intend to do. 

    But, they contain drastic errors. Now, I think you might be saying, “just generate the line work”.

    Ok, now what? 

    Generate 2 descriptions. A 3 and a 7 ac piece. And, although it looks simple, you are looking at 50/50 chance of unrecoverable errors. Acreage is off, pin is off, something is wrong. And litigation be required to fix it.

    These surveys ain’t 1965 Ford’s any more. Gotta hook em to a computer. And that may only point you in the right direction.

    The only complaint (that I know about) my dad ever had filed against him, involved something similar. He had done a survey, and the client decided he wanted it divided into 2 pieces. The client was real sure he could generate measurements. Dad was on vacation. So, he had a field hand compute the missing line, based on clients measurements.

    Long story short, it went through a building.

    The complaint against dad was “failure to supervise his field crew”.

    So, you see this as a simple problem. Surveyors see it as a potential source of liability.

    N

     

  • john-nolton

    john-nolton

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 1:56 am

    Ozarkbuilder  Why have you not answered “Norman Oklahoma” post about your error?

    You say the distance between 2 points is 575 feet yet by inverse it is 560.65 feet.

    The problem is simple if you give correct data.

  • Mark Mayer

    Mark Mayer

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 4:11 am

    BTW – holding the given bearings as exact the figure miscloses by over 5 feet.   

  • holy-cow

    holy-cow

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 4:49 am

    I am certain you are not being given the answer you hoped to get.  But, you have asked a very large group of surveyors from all over the US and, literally, around the world for an answer to a problem that is completely dependent on determinations that can only be made via field work.  The comment from someone who invested their time for no benefit to themselves to help you is that the numbers provided define a traverse that has problems (five foot misclosure).  Finding the monuments (if they all still exist) and arriving at a correct description is Job #1.  Then Job #2 becomes deciding which is the most important final area, i.e., the three acre tract or the seven acre tract.  That is because the true area will not be 10.000 acres to start with.

  • bill93

    bill93

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 5:28 am

    The local surveyor will have to find a couple monuments to determine how the bearings are to be interpreted. They could be perpetuated from magnetic compass at some unknown date (they change significantly in a few decades), astronomical/geodetic found by the last survey, a mapping projection that can only match geodetic at one line (due to the curvature of the earth), or based on some adjacent tract’s description of their common line.


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  • bill93

    bill93

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 5:42 am
    Posted by: @mark-mayer

    BTW – holding the given bearings as exact the figure miscloses by over 5 feet.   

    Did you notice that the curve is non-tangent?  That could be where your ~5 ft comes from. I haven’t calculated the traverse to check on that idea.


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  • Ozarkbuilder

    Ozarkbuilder

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 11:48 am

    This 10 is horseshoed by 46 that is being sold and surveyed. I’m waiting for a response from them to divide the ten. I was with the surveyor to show him the two west pins and he has marked every one of them shown on this survey. This survey is from 2000 and was done by the county surveyor, it is recorded. 

     

  • Norm

    Norm

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:36 pm
    Posted by: @ozarkbuilder

    Can anyone give me an idea where the line would be that splits this 10 acre tract into a 7 and 3 acre tracts? I want the beginning to start 30′ to the left of the concrete r/w monument on state route A and go to the back line. The measurement from the r/w monument to the pin on the left side of the 308.30 line on the back is 575′ if that helps. Thanks.

    I understand why my counterparts are trying to make a point to get it surveyed. With that I totally agree. However, you did say you want an idea. Good news is your exhibit calculates out to 10 acres within reason and the distances and bearings harmonize reasonably well. I agree  that the calculated distance of the “measured” 575 ft. distance is 560.65 ft. Perhaps that is a distance along the ground surface and not a plumb horizontal distance. Assuming “left” being in a westerly direction the answer is 170 ft. easterly or “right” from the westerly or “left” pin along the noted 308.3 line measured plumb on a horizontal plane- not along the ground. There is your idea. Now as has been mentioned call a surveyor to establish the split. BTW this information is worth what you paid for it. 

     

  • Norman_Oklahoma

    Norman_Oklahoma

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:42 pm
    Posted by: @bill93

    Did you notice that the curve is non-tangent? 

    Hmmm…. I did not. I now see that it could be interpreted that way ….. but why in the world? ….. one more reason to get an LS involved to investigate further.

  • Norm

    Norm

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 2:52 pm

    @norman-oklahoma 

    I don’t care for the way the exhibit notes the tangent bearing. It works out to be the forward tangent of the arc as run counterclockwise in opposition to the rest of the bearings running clockwise. Would have been better to continue clockwise along the chord. 

  • holy-cow

    holy-cow

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 5:23 pm

    I knew someone would take the time to try to give an answer.  Dang it.

  • Ozarkbuilder

    Ozarkbuilder

    Member
    August 12, 2022 at 9:38 pm
    Posted by: @norm
    Posted by: @ozarkbuilder

    Can anyone give me an idea where the line would be that splits this 10 acre tract into a 7 and 3 acre tracts? I want the beginning to start 30′ to the left of the concrete r/w monument on state route A and go to the back line. The measurement from the r/w monument to the pin on the left side of the 308.30 line on the back is 575′ if that helps. Thanks.

    I understand why my counterparts are trying to make a point to get it surveyed. With that I totally agree. However, you did say you want an idea. Good news is your exhibit calculates out to 10 acres within reason and the distances and bearings harmonize reasonably well. I agree  that the calculated distance of the “measured” 575 ft. distance is 560.65 ft. Perhaps that is a distance along the ground surface and not a plumb horizontal distance. Assuming “left” being in a westerly direction the answer is 170 ft. easterly or “right” from the westerly or “left” pin along the noted 308.3 line measured plumb on a horizontal plane- not along the ground. There is your idea. Now as has been mentioned call a surveyor to establish the split. BTW this information is worth what you paid for it. 

     

    I like how the north/south lines are parallel, that looks good. The 3 doesn’t matter to me as much as the 7. Thanks.

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