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Question for construction layout guys - Plans bust's

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Partychief67
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Here is an example Mr. Parsons of a situation that occurred with my current employer before I hired on (I replaced the guy that this happened too).

On one of their jobs part of the scope was to construct an 8' x 10' cast in place concrete utility duct from the corner of an existing building across about 400 feet to the foundation corner of a proposed building that hadn't been built yet.

The engineers drawings were straightforward showing the tie-in to the existing building right on the building corner. The centerline of the proposed duct was square to the existing foundation and set back from the corner something like 8.67 ft. to account for the thickness of the wall of the duct. The tie in at the proposed building foundation was exactly the same, centerline was offset the same distance from the corner of the foundation wall.

The surveyor laid it out exactly according to the plans the way I described it and that was the way it was built. They plugged the end of it and demobilized off the job.

Six months later they get a call from the GC reporting that the end of the duct at the proposed building is hitting right on the corner of the building and interfering with the pier cast into the foundation wall right at the building corner.

They send the surveyor that laid it out, back to the site to check it. It is perfect according to his CAD file and his paper drawings.

In the end it turns out that the engineer never received a revision in the structural foundation plans that included a new 4-1/2' x 4-1/2' L shaped load bearing column formed into the basement wall at that corner. This beam cut off half the opening width at the mouth of the duct where it intersected the building.

The duct was 100% correct according to the set of civil drawings provided to construct it.

Somehow the GC strongarmed my company into paying 50% of the cost to correct it. They demo'ed the last 40 feet of the duct and put an angle point in it to intersect the foundation wall 4 feet away from the building corner.

The surveyor that laid it out got fired for it???


 
Posted : November 25, 2010 11:22 pm
P.L.Parsons
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Sounds like politics to me, in that situation. Chances are the revision was sent to your project manager and never made it down the food chain to the field, not uncommon with large companies.

When it hit the fan, the project manager can either man up and take responsibility, or find a scapegoat. In industrial construction, option B is the norm and the layout guy gets the axe.

I can tell war stories all day about similar situations, but I've been fortunate to have discovered the answer to the problem. I've learned to find out who is responsible for distribution, then make sure I get cc'ed on all plan revisions directly from the design firm. I then forward my copy to the project manager to make certain a) they received it as well, and b) CYA as I have it in writing we both received it, cutting off any chance of being thrown under the bus when it hits the fan. That process has saved my job several times, and made sure the revisions actually make their way to the field.

It also protects the company when it is discovered the appliances that changed were installed by original design three weeks ago, and throws us into that holy of holies, Time And Materials Non Contract Change Orders.


 
Posted : November 26, 2010 6:03 am
P.L.Parsons
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Trust has nothing to do with it, nor does skill. It all comes down to money. The day they can find a process to do it cheaper, you will be gone.

Just remember, most land surveyors want in the neighborhood of 135 an hour these days, as long as you stay under that, they will keep you.

Liability is the next big thing, outside companies bring their own E/O with them, if you work directly for the company, they tote the note for liability and your mistakes fall in their lap.

The production guys are always going to want it five minutes before it occurs to them, make sure you stay three days ahead and get it right.

I've let all my safety certification lapse, including my OSHA 300 Hour card, so I can no longer be the H&S guy as well as layout. I've let all my operator cards lapse as well, so I'm no longer the backup operator when someone awards themselves a day off.

There are times when everyone else is off work and chillin', and I'm holed up in the room going over plans into the wee hours, to see to it I'm ahead of everyone else, as far as preparation. The payoff is when questions arise about revisions two months down the road, and we got it right.


 
Posted : November 26, 2010 6:17 am
roadhand
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Yes, just as PL says, document,document,document and cya cya cya. When they start pointing fingers nothing feels better than proving them wrong and maybe exposing their incompetency and or unwillingness to tell the truth.;-)

I have a theory about PMs, Supers and even owners. We make it look so easy that they ALL think that they could do our jobs. You do get the few that actually know better,and they are the ones whose jobs never have any major problems, but it seems that they are getting fewer and farther inbetween.


 
Posted : November 26, 2010 6:33 am
P.L.Parsons
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I'm fortunate in my present situation, as the PM already had his personal train wreck as far as layout goes, and is why he became an office weenie instead.

Well, that and the degrees in construction management and finance.....

Every PM should do a rotation as field engineer, but not actual layout. They need to see what is involved, and why certain things such as deviation of timeline and immediate out of pocket expenses are massive money savers today, and a waste of resources tomorrow when it gets approved.


 
Posted : November 26, 2010 7:35 am

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