I know there are many of you that swear by this thing, so I'm kicking the tires and have a few questions that may help me out.
Performance/Settings
1) Will this thing pair with an Epoch 50 as a base station?
2) I am not planning to use a base, just plan to use the LS as a network rover. Will this still work pretty good under tree cover? In you experience, how long does it take to get a fix under full canopy? (lets say in a wooded area) Are we talking a minute or two per shot, or are we talking letting it cook for a while? (I understand it can be different at different times etc, but trying to get an idea if this will work for me) I mostly plan to locate old boundary stone walls, so im not talking needing a fix at a half inch precision, I would accept 3 inches in this situation. With no base do you think I will be satisfied or will I not get what I am looking for?
3) I have an AT&T card for our current data collectors for RTK, but half the time we use our cell phones WIFI hotspot. Should i enable both options on the LS? If not, which do you think would work better? If I am able to use the Epoch 50 as a base, would any of these options make a difference?
General Question
1) Javad offers the full money back guarantee, but when asked (so far) I have not gotten any paperwork to sign. I was only asked to call and make a payment for $13k. I am not sure how comfortable I am with sending out 13k with no purchase order to sign or any paperwork that states this return policy besides an email. Has anyone had any experience with this or insight? Has anyone taken up the offer for the return guarantee? (not that i want to bank on that, but if it doesn't work as I would like it to with no base there would be no reason for me to keep it)
Thank you in advance!
Rich
Always paperwork.
Gotta keep the tax man happy if nothing else.
1. If your Epoch 50 transmits on UHF and the Triumph-LS has a UHF radio, then you should be able to receive corrections from the Epoch 50, but we don't make guarantees of this because there are things beyond our control with the use of a third-party base station.
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2. Time to fix will likely be longer and precision will likely be lower using an RTN instead of a local base. Sometimes these are acceptable sacrifices given the convenience and security that an RTN provides. The Triumph-LS works well under canopy, but there are so many variables, it is difficult to provide specific answers to performance under canopy. The boundary profile, which I recommend for collection of any points of consequence under canopy, requires a minimum of 3 minutes. During this time the LS resets its engines several times and regains a fixed solution, making comparisons of the fixed solutions, until a certain number of agreeable fixes have been acquired. At the end of the observation it resets one last time and acquires the fix once more comparing the last fix to the first to prove the fix is good. Fixed solutions can take time to acquire, so the actual time of observation may be only three minutes or considerably longer depending on how long it takes to acquire the prescribed number of fixes.?ÿ
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3. The Triumph-LS comes equipped with WiFi, so if you are happy using a cellular hotspot, you don't need to pay for any additional features. If you prefer the convenience of an integrated, all-in-one solution, you might want to spend the extra $1000 for the GSM modem activation which would allow you to put an AT&T SIM card in and work without the external hotspot.
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4. The offer is for real, but if you need something more substantial I would work with your salesperson to get whatever documentation you feel you may need.
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Best Regards,
Shawn
1 - I don't know
2 - fixes are pretty much instant just about anywhere, whether they're any good is the question. Closer CORS make it faster and better quality. you can customize quality control to repeated observations within a desired range or length of time, as well as how many repeating solutions (engines) within the range. Many users would probably be satisfied with network if CORS within 5-10 miles. I use mostly local base because CORS usually no closer than 25 miles.
3 - I use hotspot on phone (ATT) and verizon hotspot ($15 month for a month when I'll need it, straight talk). I haven't had any trouble but some users have said the hotspot routine was getting interrupted and going to a sim card in the unit was much better. If I recall, it comes standard with GSM so can be turned on easily if you later decide you want the option, but switching to verizon would require sending in for modem exchange and costs more.?ÿ They may have changed that recently, so you should ask what it takes to turn on either at later date. Also ask about external wifi antenna port, not sure if it's standard now, but gives better distance than internal if you need distance. I would want uhf just in case want to use as local base and rover.
4 - Haven't heard of anyone returning in 30 day period.?ÿ But yeah, ask for documentation.
1) Will this thing pair with an Epoch 50 as a base station??ÿ?ÿ
I don't know. But, I would not do that, if it could. The Javad package of LS-Base-Radio places a REAL base station NEAR your project, increasing production speed. When you want it right, this is best.
Will this still work pretty good under tree cover??ÿ ?ÿIn you experience, how long does it take to get a fix under full canopy??ÿ (lets say in a wooded area)?ÿ ?ÿAre we talking a minute or two per shot, or are we talking letting it cook for a while?
Tree cover is TOTALLY subjective. That is, MY definition, and YOUR and every other surveyors definition. Rich, get a demo. In canopy, your accuracy is LESS. It may be only a few hundredths, but it is usually less.
Here is a screen shot, from under some canopy:
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The left hand square shows HORIZONTAL, and the right hand shows VERTICAL shot spread. The MAIN cluster of this shot is about 0.08' square.
I have shot this point twice. This is the second shot. The "Dist to last" button shows it is 0.040' from the last shot.
I have screen shots turned on, for all my boundary work. So, I can see the quality of the shot, later in the office. I have spent 206 seconds on this point, and I have 961 epochs on it. Generally, a knowledge of the QUALITY of a shot, is very important.
This is a screen shot I get on EVERY point, (with a few exceptions)
Disclaimer:
I don't work for Javad.
Nate
Thank you all.
@nate-the-surveyor I am in the northeast, about 20 minutes from NYC. Im sure my 'treecover' is not tree cover like other areas.
This post was super informative and instructive on how to read that 'confusing' screen!
I want to get a demo, I had asked if someone in the area could demo a unit but was directed towards the buy it and if need be, return it method, which I am a little skeptical of. Adam had sent me a message telling me I could request they send a demo (to buy or to demo i am not sure) but that would be the best route. From your post and what I have read, it seems like this will work for us, but I wouldnt know for sure until I was able to use and test it.
Thanks again!
To the West about 220 miles
Michael ??Sean? Joyce
(USA)J-Team Member/Survey Product Sales
Address:Chemung, NY
Phone:607-529-6320
E-mail:jsma@frontiernet.net
And, to the North West about 270 Miles
Duane Frymire
(USA)J-Team Member/Survey Product Sales
Address:Woodgate, NY
Phone:315-392-2384
E-mail:dcfpls@hotmail.com
I would encourage you to consider adding a Javad base to the Triumph-LS. With a Javad base, you have access to DPOS for post-processing your base raw data files to the CORS and for post-processing the vector from the base to the rover. The base/rover post-processing can be used for a check on the RTK solution, can be used to fill in when communications aren't available and at times get a solution when RTK cannot in very dense canopy (given long observations).?ÿ
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Having a Javad base will also allow you to use our very stream-lined base/rover setup which sets the base and rover communication parameters simultaneously and includes blunder detection tools for helping make sure you are on the correct point.?ÿ
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Of course I can appreciate working within a budget and you can always add a Javad base to your Triumph-LS later if you decide it is worth the investment.
