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Quick Boundary related question. A first for me seeing this.
So I have seen several odd calls for boundaries but this is a new one. The line is called for from a culvert. This is very old deed 1940’s. Now the more i talk to owners and such it makes a little sense. Can’t find anything that predates this deed. Not anything more recent either. But it does all for beginning at a culvert then no bearings no distance along road to X property then to the river then down the river to yep the culvert other end. So the culvert road and several feet of land was washed away in a flood 1970’s. Then filled back i. A ditch was cut and changes made to other side of road so no culvert on that end found. Ditch was filled in because owner didn’t like ditch. What i have is the resemblance of that ditch which in theory was placed about where the culvert was before flood. But in early 2000’s another flood and well what we see now as a small ditch wash out may or may not be correct. As i look up the mountain on other side where culvert might have been its a clear sign of how water was coming down and cut out coming down to road. So again in theory this cut out on opposite side of road of my property lines up with the apparent ditch wash out etc running across to the river. It makes the acreage about right give or take. Thats the only mathematical piece we have. I am sure once we get ROW plans that line has a road so it can become the south line and other road. But just thought i would ask here opinions from experts. So basically southern line running east n west road and bridge crossing the river which establishes the east line which runs North south parallel to that is another road on west side of property. North line is bound by adjoining lot. Monumented so all good there.
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9 Replies
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I was curious if you looked for any historical aerial photography that might give you some idea as to the location of the original culvert. It probably would not be of sufficient resolution to identify the culvert itself but could show a defined ditch.
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I’m with Gary on this, I’ve used historical photos for a number of reasons. Locally the NRCS keeps photos going back well before the 1970’s and some are quite clear. Photos taken with airplane flights swamp satellites for clarity. And there are options available on-line.
Since you’re talking about a culvert and ditches does the SEO or your state’s equivalent keep records for those facilities?
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Here’s a link to a federal source for historic aerial photos. Scroll down the page to the link for the Earth Explorer interactive map. You will need to sign up with a username and password to download the photo images.
usgs.gov
USGS EROS Archive - Aerial Photography - Aerial Photo Single Frames | U.S. Geological Survey
Black-and-white, natural color, and color infrared aerial photographs over the United States are available in a digital format at a resolution of 400 or 1,000 dpi. (1937 - 2014)
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This could also be a situation where conversing with the adjoining owners will help. “Where do you think your property lines are, and why?” type of questions. If all the adjoining deeds/descriptions are as non-specific as the original parcel, perhaps it’s time to come up with boundary line agreements or whatever might me allowed in your jurisdiction. What types of improvements are on the subject and adjoining parcels?
Jeff D. -
Sorry for the late response. It’s been a busy week and in no cell zones. I have not. Yet. We had a road trip of jobs. 5.5hrs monday drive to one job. Start mapping finished late Tuesday. Drove 6 plus hours to another job Wednesday and started the looking for evidence kinda a last minute thing so not much time to prepare. But we finished up this morning before lunch and drove back home tonight. Just literally walked in the door. Now getting laptop fired up. To start processing last days worth of data. And start on 3 other projects from out of state tomorrow. It will be a long weekend for sure. Once i get back to researching on this next week sometime maybe I will find out how my gut checks work. I ended up digging down on opposite side of road where I thought would be about where a culvert would have been. If it was a cmp. I think i nailed it found some rust and old concrete where sorta resembles an old head wall pieces but without a jack hammer i could not get deep or into it far enough to 100% verify. Got a string of shots crossing the road where magy picked up some faint sounds. Went to river bank crawled down it where old ditch came towards lined up with culvert or maggy readings eye ball. And found rip rap type pattern and more crushed headwall. No culvert pipe .
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Thank you. I will check this out. I am pretty familiar with NRCS maps and such as i used that for making farm decisions etc. I appreciate the link.
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Well no adjoining owners. Roads and river. Parcel to north same owner. This whole area was completely wiped out by floods. Yes two different ones. One around 1970 I believe and another early 2000 i have notes on exact date’s just not with me. As I been on road. Thanks for the knowledge. Its awesome here on this site. Just learning and bouncing ideas off and different viewpoints to look and think about. Wow truly helps.
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Lot of times culverts will have stationing on them, be shown on plans with stationing or both. If you were able to lay your hands on the highway plans that were used when the culvert was placed, you might be able to work it backwards or forwards and reestablish where it was, assuming the alignment hasn’t changed significantly. Chances are if it was placed that long ago and significant work has been done post flood, you might be SOL.
Willy -
Very true. I think the LS is getting some of that info. Hopefully i will get a chance to look at that but we are so swamped right now before holidays kick in with many already taking vacation and already short staffed. I was in field this week and i can barely move. Lol. Myself and my sr crew chief we knocked out two jobs that were planned for us to be at until Saturday. So we bought ourselves an extra day or so. He is heading to help another crew tomorrow finish another nob while i try and get other projects ready for deliverables. New boss started Monday and I have only communicated today via email and text. What a firestorm she has walked into this week. But I think we will somehow get it all done. I am doing all I can to keep Murphy at a distance. LOL. That joker is sneaky and likes to show up as soon as you let your guard down.
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