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I'm hoping to get some help reading an old deed.
My confusion is what land or parcels are include and what is excluded (excepted).
The deed is from 1982 and its paragraphs, in order, are:
1)?ÿ "All that tract of land...beginning at...containing about 16 acres of land)"
2)?ÿ "Excepting and Reserving...nineteen square rods of land more or less"
3)?ÿ "Reserving the right of way along the public highway crossing said premises"
4)?ÿ "Being the same parcel...1891...liber 104...."
5)?ÿ "Also excepting and reserving, all that tract of land...containing 3 acres"
6)?ÿ "Also excepting and reserving a small lot on which the small barn stands...according to a survey made...1911"
7)?ÿ "Also a piece of land...containing 2 acres
8)?ÿ "Being the same premises conveyed...1915"
9)?ÿ "Being the same premises conveyed...1923"
10) "Excepting and reserving all that piece of parcel of land heretofore conveyed...1972...and described as follows:"
11) "All that certain plot...described as follows:"
12) "Beginning at a point...contained 13.68 acres"
13) "All as shows on survey map...."
14) "Being the same premises...recorded...1982"
So, I have no idea what is included and what isn't.?ÿ The records after the time of this deed are pretty messed up.?ÿ The person who bought the property with this deed is shown to received 10.39 acres.
Any help reading this would be very appreciated.
Thank you!
Joseph
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Sounds like some real down to earth field work and lots of time in the courthouse pouring over records.?ÿ My suggestion is to first find the map mentioned in your no. 13.
The rest of it is like eating an elephant...you do it one bite at a time.?ÿ 😉
BTW - Around here acreages listed in deeds are notoriously inaccurate and at times just flat wrong.
The entire document would need to be reviewed ...VERY CAREFULLY...to even begin to answer your question.?ÿ Punctuation alone can completely change intent.?ÿ How the wording is laid out on the page(s) can change intent.?ÿ Sorry, but there is no quick or simple answer to something like this.
As Paden mentioned, acreage is very low on our list of importance in the wording of a document.
Hate to tell you this but lengthy descriptions are prone to having errors simply because the average person cannot follow the logic involved.?ÿ Thus errors get inserted into the description and no one else catches it................for decades sometimes.
I had a case where what had once been a large tract had been split into three tracts, each with a rather lengthy description.?ÿ Eventually one person acquired all three of the tracts one at a time, meaning the original tract description could have been used when he went to sell the entire large tract.?ÿ That did not happen.?ÿ When the deed was drafted for that transaction it consisted of the long-winded description of one fraction of the total, the word "and", then the long-winded description of a second fraction, then the word "and"
That was it.?ÿ The third long-winded description was not included, although it absolutely was intended to be included.?ÿ Several attorneys, the buyer, the seller, the appraiser, the real estate company, the title company and two lenders..............no one noticed the missing fraction.?ÿ A few months later I was called upon to sever a fraction of the large tract.?ÿ The part they wanted to sever was partly in one of the fractions conveyed but the remainder was in the fraction that had been left off the deed.?ÿ Thus, I was the one who finally found the error.
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Paden and Holy:?ÿ Thank you so much for the insights.?ÿ It's clear this is not going to be easy -- that is, far more difficult than I can handle on my own.
I don't know if it would help, but the deed (1985) that follows this one (that is, the deed where the buyer listed on the first deed, above, is listed as the seller), had a survey done in 1984 (all new metes and bounds) and declared it 10.39 acres.?ÿ
I tried to plug in the property description into a plotter but got lost when at the 2 parts of the description that called for "an intersection with a non-tangent curve having a radius...).
The circumstances that lead me to this is I just bought a lot (1.75 acres) that looks like it came out of these lands.
However, between 1985 and 1991 (when the town shows the lot as 1.75 acres) there exists no explanation.?ÿ (In 1991, the town foreclosed for taxes on the property and declared it 1.75 acres).
There are no surveyors tapes on the lot.
Any suggestions on how to figure out exactly the borders?
Thank you!
Locating this definitely calls for a surveyor, preferably one acquainted with local practices, and one who tries to get it right before callng it done.
It could be expensive. Having so many pieces involved, and the curve being non-tangent add up to head scratching. Hope the ~1.75 acres is worth it.
All prior surveys can help assemble the clues.
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I never like it when a client brings in such a deed and they usually do not welcome the cost of getting it surveyed because of all the extra research involved and the extra time involved to sort it all out.
The only way to solve your situation is to get the property surveyed by a qualified licensed surveyor.
good luck
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When I was working in GIS ( GASP HISS BOO ARGHHHH) I was asked to map up a parcel a couple had paid the taxes and tax liens, and subsequently the foreclosure proceedings and conveyed ownership via the due process of the county.
Except, the parcel didn't exist.?ÿ It did on a piece of paper that someone had filed with the county years prior, but on further research and even more research, nothing existed except this bogus deed and drawing. I explained that I wasn't giving them legal advice, but that they should probably go ask the County Treasurer to refund them all the monies paid, and then wondered to myself how long the county had been collecting the taxes on that bogus parcel, and the likely dozens of more others that existed.
Like the rest have wisely mentioned, only a real forensic type survey will create the daylight in this murky situation.
Good Luck.
Thank you all very much for your help.
So I've been able to figure out that the deed I plotted is the adjacent lot.
Is there a service available to read and plot old deeds?
Or is someone here willing and able to do it (for a fee, of course)?
I've attached the deed.
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We have many participants here.?ÿ Surely one or more who work in your area will notice this message and respond.
That description represents a very nice jigsaw puzzle that would only become clear to those working near your location.?ÿ Ideally, this would be someone who works in or near Sullivan County, New York regularly.
Looking at an aerial view of Fallsburg, it appears this area must be either forested or swampy or both as there are so few roads and areas of development.?ÿ Locating the true boundaries on the ground could be an adventure in itself.
On a side note, following this website is quite educational.?ÿ I learn new information every day.?ÿ Much of it is not directly related to surveying but more related to the geography of the areas where others work, from Tasmania to Belgium.?ÿ This morning I have already learned a new word for my vocabulary by simply looking at an aerial view of Fallsburg.?ÿ That word is mikva.?ÿ I'm guessing it is many miles from my house to the nearest mikva in any direction.?ÿ I am based in rural Kansas.
OMG!?ÿ LOL!?ÿ That is so funny.?ÿ Yes, there are probably a number of words that would show up on google maps around here that wouldn't in Kansas:?ÿ Mikva, Machaneh, Bungalow Colony, Shul.?ÿ There is a sizable ultra-religious Jewish community here and those terms are specific to that group.?ÿ There is also a sizable secular (non-religious) Jewish community.?ÿ And a sizable Cristian community.?ÿ We work at it....
Your advice is is very wise indeed:?ÿ I will be reading many more of these posts, as I am very interested in surveying, title/deed issues and geography.
I bought a piece 1/2 mile down the road (2 lots, actually) totalling 60 acres that after months of discussions and debates among the surveyor, the title company and my lawyers, the court (and neighbors) agreed that it was actually 66 acres (with court-recognized boundaries).
So, the deeds around here are often in really, really bad shape.
Thank you!
Here's something that might be worth tracking down.?ÿ
| Title | Maps of Fallsburgh, Loch Sheldrake, Centerville and Sandburgh in the Town of Fallsburgh |
| Description | Maps show land ownership, businesses, schools, churches, cemeteries railroads and bodies of water. |
| Scale | 40 rods to one inch (Fallsburgh); 40 rods to one inch (Loch Sheldrake); 40 rods to one inch (Sandburgh); 30 rods to one inch (Centerville); |
| Date of Original | 1875 |
https://cdm16694.contentdm.oclc.org/digital/collection/uccc/id/221
Also
Or here it appears here with a magnifying option.?ÿ Note that it has a notation B.S.Sh.?ÿ which could possibly be the blacksmith shop referred to in the deed. Also an M.E. Church that is referred to somewhere in the deed.
Various history links for the area:
http://www.betweenthelakes.com/fallsburgh.htm
The above map from a downloadable source:
https://www.loc.gov/resource/g3803sm.gla00190/?sp=21&r=-0.279,0.083,1.232,0.422,0
Very nice and very old map! Town's name has changed, RR no longer there, and, worst of all, no blacksmith shop!
Thank you for sending this and for pointing out the blacksmith shop and church -- 2 things mentioned in the deed (indeed).
Did the RR become the power line easement seen on Google Earth?
Does the iron bridge or other object(s) mentioned still exist?
My first attempt to plot the shape of the first parcel made no sense. Either I made a mistake or there is at least one reversed bearing in the description.
I don't know if the RR became an electric co easement.
Sandburg Creek crosses route 55 repeatedly.?ÿ Just a handful of feet West (that's a technical term for you lay people out there) of my property line is a bridge. and several hundred feet further West is another bridge -- the creek crosses from the North of the road to the South and then back again to the North.?ÿ So, I'm not sure which iron bridge the property descriptions are referring to.
I think these are the details of the bridge that is just West of my property:
|
MOUNTAINDALE ROAD over SANDBURG CREEK |
|
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Structure number: |
000000003355590 |
|
Location: |
.8 MI SE OF MOUNTAINDALE |
|
Purpose: |
Carries highway over waterway |
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Route classification: |
Major Collector (Rural) [07] |
|
Length of largest span: |
34.1 ft. [10.4 m] |
|
Total length: |
36.1 ft. [11.0 m] |
|
Roadway width between curbs: |
30.2 ft. [9.2 m] |
|
Deck width edge-to-edge: |
32.2 ft. [9.8 m] |
|
Skew angle: |
30?ø |
|
Owner: |
County Highway Agency [02] |
|
Year built: |
2004 |
|
Historic significance: |
Bridge is not eligible for the National Register of Historic Places [5] |
|
Design load: |
MS 22.5 / HS 25 [9] |
|
Main span material: |
Prestressed concrete [5] |
|
Main span design: |
Box beam or girders - Multiple [05] |
|
Deck type: |
Not applicable [N] |
|
Wearing surface: |
Bituminous [6] |
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I'm still doing my homework.?ÿ There was a very nice researcher at the County Clerk's office who suggested I continue to look at older and older deeds in the chain, so I've been doing that.?ÿ It's actually somewhat fun to try to piece this together.?ÿ I now know how to find old grantors and grantees and then find the associated deeds.?ÿ But understanding the property descriptions is what's tripping me up.
This is what I've got so far.?ÿ Still hung up on how to read the description in 762/1133 & 1046/285.?ÿ I'll get 429/74 today and hope it sheds some light.
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If you are serious about getting it surveyed, talk to Rick Brooks at Brooks & Brooks Land Surveying.?ÿ https://bnbpc.biz/contact-2/
Thank you very much for the recommendation. Their office is over an hour away, in a different county -- might make sense to find someone more local (if I can't figure this out myself).
@ars-mine-surveyor
an hour away and a different county is nothing. You have a complicated parcel; hire a good surveyor.
Maybe you can find a Surveyor closer to you at:
How would you interpret the call in this deed
north 58 3/4 degrees west 12/80 chains
With the other calls, 12.80 chains does not make a reasonable shaped parcel, and I can't figure out why anyone would use the fraction 12/80 chains.
It isn't going to be possible to mathematically check closure because the last calls are "northwesterly" and "southerly" with no degrees or distances.?ÿ I'd like to get an approximate shape for this parcel to compare to aerials and GIS cartoons to see if the corners can fit roads or other discernible points.
