You are retracing a Spanish Land Grant in the PLSS. The plat shows meander corners and not angle points. There is not a drop of water for many miles and never has been to my knowledge. In the field notes, the deputy surveyor states that the authorizing documents describe the boundary by roads on two sides, a line of hills on another, and a mountain on the other. The deputy had difficultly locating portions of the roads and took parole evidence to establish some locations.
Today there is no visible evidence for long stretches of the roads. Iron pipes are found reasonably close to the platted locations of the meander corners. The deputy set stones but after a diligent search, no stones are found.
Do you?
1. Hold the pipes as angle points with the boundary running straight line between them.
2. Hold the pipes as meander corners with the boundary running along the feature. Try to research old aerials, talk to old timers, etc to attempt a determination of the road locations where there is no physical evidence.
3. Something else.
Thanks in advance. Scott
#2
Old aerials, maps, and any other documentation and testimony that may tend to establish the location of the roads at any point or portion. Hopefully some of that evidence will tend to corroborate the pipe locations and the meander courses as adjusted between them. If you find good aerials (or reliable detailed mapping) of the roads and/or base of hills/mountain, that would be more reliable than the record meander courses. If you can't find good aerials or reliable detailed mapping, the meander courses would be your best evidence where the physical evidence has disappeared.
I would not use #1 if you have record of the meander courses. Even if you have no other evidence to corroborate the meanders, they are evidence of the old road (or base of hills/mountain) at the time of the original survey. I assume that you have no evidence that either roads or base of hills/mountains existed along straight lines between the meander corners. If that assumption is correct, you have no valid basis for holding straight lines if you have record meander courses.
ScottySantaFe, post: 443305, member: 9477 wrote: after a diligent search, no stones are found.
Do you suspect that they've been taken out?
If they were in fact set; then they are still there.
eapls2708, post: 443670, member: 589 wrote: #2
Old aerials, maps, and any other documentation and testimony that may tend to establish the location of the roads at any point or portion. Hopefully some of that evidence will tend to corroborate the pipe locations and the meander courses as adjusted between them. If you find good aerials (or reliable detailed mapping) of the roads and/or base of hills/mountain, that would be more reliable than the record meander courses. If you can't find good aerials or reliable detailed mapping, the meander courses would be your best evidence where the physical evidence has disappeared.
I would not use #1 if you have record of the meander courses. Even if you have no other evidence to corroborate the meanders, they are evidence of the old road (or base of hills/mountain) at the time of the original survey. I assume that you have no evidence that either roads or base of hills/mountains existed along straight lines between the meander corners. If that assumption is correct, you have no valid basis for holding straight lines if you have record meander courses.
Thank you for taking the time to respond. To give full disclosure, this scenario is based on a survey that I worked on a couple of years ago. For that survey, we were retracing a portion of the grant line. That portion had been previously surveyed and agreed upon by both sides. The pipes were set by one of the prior surveyors, aprox. 1970, when he subdivided the grant. He referenced the pipes as meander corners and held straight lines between them.
The original plat also shows straight lines between the meander corners.
If the area is not in dispute and the original or perpetuated monuments are found, should an effort be made to determine the original features location?
What is the legal significance of a meandered but non-riparian line, and does it require different retracement procedures?
Thanks, Scott
RADAR, post: 443675, member: 413 wrote: Do you suspect that they've been taken out?
If they were in fact set; then they are still there.
You're right. We diligently searched in the areas where there were no pipes. When we found the pipes, we quit looking. The original stones could be buried under the pipes.
X
ScottySantaFe, post: 443719, member: 9477 wrote: You're right. We diligently searched in the areas where there were no pipes. When we found the pipes, we quit looking. The original stones could be buried under the pipes.
I would dig at least one up. Trying to locate the road that the GLO surveyor had trouble finding is not the way to go. The private ownership is based on the GLO survey, even if the GLO incorrectly located it.
A meander corner on
a grant can be the equivalent of an angle point or it can be a meander of a natural feature, like a mountain.
If the grant calls for a natural feature and the notes call for a course along it, the actual natural feature will control, not the monumented meanders.
aliquot, post: 443809, member: 2486 wrote: X
I would dig at least one up. Trying to locate the road that the GLO surveyor had trouble finding is not the way to go. The private ownership is based on the GLO survey, even if the GLO incorrectly located it.
A meander corner on
a grant can be the equivalent of an angle point or it can be a meander of a natural feature, like a mountain.If the grant calls for a natural feature and the notes call for a course along it, the actual natural feature will control, not the monumented meanders.
Absolutely. Still fun to find GLO rocks;^)
