My head hurts now without thermo and statics etc.
My head hurts after reading this post..... ?????ÿ
Good question, Jitterboogie.?ÿ I think there are quite a few people in what I suppose would be called the "Middle Class" of the survey industry trying to figure out where they fit.?ÿ So many tasks out there.?ÿ But I fall in the same camp as you, assuming that strong skills in the CAD arena create more opportunities when it comes to the tasks that you're assigned.?ÿ Now, whether or not it's fair to assign those tasks to the survey tech is another question.
I think it depends on what kind of workplace you inhabit.?ÿ I briefly worked at a Civil Engineer & Survey Firm when I started and it wouldn't be uncommon for people who were with 4 years experience (not LSIT) to be creating drainage plans and doing introductory road design from survey information gathered.?ÿ However, that was a small firm with <10 total employees, so everyone wore at least 2 hats.?ÿ?ÿ
The problem for you is that this type of work does not add any time to you working and being in responsible charge. In ten years of this work you may be lucky to have 2 years of acceptable experience. It you are looking to take the PS exam you might want to consider working for less for a smaller survey firm that needs competent field crew. It cost me considerably in lower paychecks to get bonafide experience, but I am satisfied with what I got out of it. I actually gave up professional engineering opportunities to eventually make less money as a surveyor. My children were out of college, I went back to school, worked for less money and my wife did not object. She is now rewarded by getting occasional opportunities to work in the brier patch or collecting EP shots. Her only question is, "Am I wearing green or orange?"
Paul in PA, PE, PLS
PS, I doubt you want to wait till you are that old.
Thanks for the candor.?ÿ The whole responsible charge crap is where I really get peeved. It's so subjective, and no one, can accurately define and list what that is. It one of this professions weakest and most ridiculous aspects. No one, no plumber, doctor lawyers, Nurses, Nurse practitioner, Pharmacist, Electricians, and on and on and on....have any difficulty defining what and how they are measured. Last year someone here (and you responded too) was having a terrible time getting his ex father in law to validate his time, and he was refusing. WTF. Adding a college degree did nothing to weed out that kind of crap.
Either way, maybe we need to add a third test, a?ÿ week field practicum, like a solo in an aircraft, where you get to show how well you were trained, and if you fail, the consequences are double, the instructor should be evaluated then too, i.e. the licences willing to sign off on your responsible charge.?ÿ
I've collected data for ALTAs but didn't draft them. I've set boundary monuments, and struck boundary lines based upon evidence and research and sign off from a licensed surveyor. Do I need to quantify the minutes into hours and then days and years to finally build up enough time? I'm not ready to be licensed and I know that. But the lack of concrete time and defined quantifiable experience has to be real.
It's just ridiculous. Sometimes I wonder why I didn't try harder to get into medical school, and then I remember, I don't like sick people.
It's easier than surveying, to get through,and lacks this bizarre random arbitrary capriciousness that seems to plague the process, and again, I'm in a state that's got a descending population and an incomplete and largely unavailable board, so my angst, isn't the entire country, but not far off in a lot of places.
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Sorry?ÿ
Had another 103+ fever.?ÿ
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Do you have different classifications? E.g. Shovel operator, machete operator, brash ax operator, Burro (stake bag carrier), etc.?
@richardlhardison I don't, but I'm sure you could find an HR person to dream up some. I kinda like that " Brash" Ax Operator. Your Firm have any openings for a "Brash" Ax Operators,
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Knock it off you two.
No ad hominem.
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Information only, otherwise I'll sick Angel on you.
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Carry on.
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@jitterboogie I agree. Field is important, and I need more of it. Office is important, and I need more of that. I recently made a move from a field only/warm body/dead end/little to no mentorship (by the PLS) or training, until you messed up, position to a spot with practically daily mentorship/learning and quite a bit of office time with the associated mentorship there. It was a great move for me. I was truthful about my abilities and what I was looking for: mentorship towards being a qualified PLS, not just signed off on. Our company encourages attending seminars/workshops that will benefit us both. It's been a well balanced blend of client communications, estimating, research, writing easements/descriptions, boundary/construction field surveys, calc'ing stakeout/search points for field crew, exposure to the financial reports/department goals. Really feeling pretty good about where I am right now.
@jbw?ÿ
Sounds like the perfect situation. Hope the money is decent too.
Sometimes you have to choose between money and professional growth.?ÿ It's nice when they're not mutually exclusive
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I climbed the tree from the bottom.?ÿ First job at 18 was brushing/toting on a seasonal 5 man BLM crew and that was hard work. Over the next 3 years seasonally worked for the USFS and climbed to chainman, instrumentman, bookman?ÿ and finally party chief,?ÿ camping out for ten day schedules, etc and it was still hard work.?ÿ Went into the privates for more pay which was less hard work, construction staking, urban boundary, photogrammetric control.?ÿ Got my license and switched to County surveyor for the medical/pension benefits and learned the ropes of the office end of it.?ÿ Did a Beverly Hillbilly's "move to Beverly it's the place you want to be" during an Orange County housing boom, got my Cali' license and doubled my salary, but after a few years, running 5 crews and the record mapping wore me down.?ÿ So I switched to a mid-level LS job in a State department for a 50% pay cut but lo and behold in three years the Union won a lawsuit concerning "Pay Parity" so I was making the same as in the privates.?ÿ So I spent?ÿ 16 years there to build up a pension, SS, etc.?ÿ It was kinda dull in that the organization involved 800 people so I was niched into "Records Management" and ultimately digitized 200,000 survey records and others, administering contracts and indexing for serving up on the Department's Intranet.
But I've been retired since 2015 so that's all ancient history for me.?ÿ One piece of advice for Cheechakos is plan ahead, save for your retirement and concentrate on an exit strategy when you're in your '50s.?ÿ Anybody that's sitting on Survey Technicians' wages as a retirement plan will be sorely disappointed.
I had to laugh, just the other day a two man survey crew arrived one Saturday morning just up the road from us, to do what looked like a boundary survey of the neighbor down a right of way, across the road.
I was doing home office work, so I was able to watch them all day. Things started off well, with No.1 doing a lot of talking and hand pointing and No.2 solidified in thought, then them going up the road to find a control, with No.2 carrying the tripod and what not, slung like Rambo lighting up a 50 cal machine gun.
That's as good as it got. It was a long day for them, by the end of which communications between the two appeared to have long since been severed and No.1 was retrieving and packing all the gear while No.2 was leaning against a power pole, watching, with grin on his face. Job done.
I haven't read the whole thread yet, but when I was a SIT, I was hungry (and still am) to get experience and learn as many tasks and in many disciplines as much as possible. This helps on MANY things, mostly when studying for the exams, having more experience than the next guy when looking for employment, and generally being knowledgeable and well-rounded. If you feel you're not getting experience in boundary survey, I'd consider moving to a smaller surveying firm that mostly do this. I'm from Puerto Rico, and I feel lucky that we are allowed to take the SIT and the PS right after college. At any time, although I don't know if this has changed now for the better or worse. I passed both the SIT and PS the same year, but only I would get my license and certificate after completing 2 years of experience. I was lucky to join a surveying firm with a high pay grade to actually get experience on boundary surveys, all because I passed my tests.
