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"Family" member in deep (long)
So,
The guardians of my Grandson (we’ll call him Joe) recently purchased a 5 acre tract with a manufactured home. They asked me if I would come down and find the corners and mark some lot lines. I checked with their broker and the attorney to see if a survey was needed prior to closing. They advised that since the tract was part of a recorded subdivision, a survey prior to closing would not be necessary. They get the deal closed and I went down to have a look around. The property is an irregular tract bordered by two creeks with triple-canopy jungle in-between and medium p.i.a. terrain to boot. I got in the woods and found a couple of pins and noticed a fence line that seemed badly out of place. A nasty storm rolled in and we were done for the day. Before I left, I explained that we were in for quite a difficult time and that it was beyond the scope of doing a favor, even for “family”.
I went to the original surveyor’s office and explained the situation to him. He thought he could get everything recovered and mark the lines in a day or so for around a thousand dollars. This seemed reasonable to me (I would have been around $3k for this particular tract) and I advised the guardians to get him on the site to handle this thing.
Well he gets out there and starts to find that things are awry. Bad. He checked into his control ok, but when he gets to the first corner, it’s “out”. As in 80 feet out. He goes into WTF mode and traverses up to the next corner (with Joe in tow) and finds nothing better up there. Joe has specific questions about the location of a concrete pad that was represented by the broker as being his. He asks the surveyor if the pad is on his lot and the surveyor, still trying to figure out what’s going on cannot give an answer. This upsets Joe, who is like “how can you not know”? Understandable that the surveyor doesn’t want to make a statement about something like that until he gets a handle on what’s going on with the line.
Joe is pissed. He thinks the surveyor is running the clock on him. The surveyor has no idea WTF is going on with his old boundary and is suspicious that pins have been moved. He was nearly in a fistfight with one of the adjoiners. This is still a work in progress.I feel terrible that I did not insist that Joe get a survey (not by me) prior to closing. I feel that he was given bad counsel by the “professionals” who guided him through the transaction without advising him to have a survey done. I feel bad for the surveyor, who is losing sleep over what in the hell is going on. The reason I kept out of it for the most part is that I am also a broker, and was hesitant to involve myself in another broker’s deal.
So, I feel like sh*t all the way around.
I have advised Joe to let the surveyor finish has work and come up with an explanation of what happened. Then seek remedy as guided by an attorney of his choosing.
Any advice?
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12 Replies
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Your advice seems very appropriate to me. Don’t you just hate it when the property owner “is in tow”.
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You did precisely the correct thing. It is wonderful that the original surveyor is involved and discovering the situation. Either his crew did a terrible job or “someone” has been moving things around to suit their own desires.
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Joe is the guardian, not the grandson, right?
We need more clarification, not enougfh info to give an opinion.
Never,never, never, never, never, never, do anything without a signed contract, clearly outlining the scope of services and full payment beforehand, even for family.
This is obviously a violation of NC law. “Joe in tow” can easily be construed as surveying without a license. I have already tried to reach the director at home but to no avail. I will be on the phone to the board on MOnday morning.
Excuse me stewardess. I speak POB 😉
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> I feel terrible that I did not insist that Joe get a survey (not by me) prior to closing. I feel that he was given bad counsel by the “professionals” who guided him through the transaction without advising him to have a survey done. I feel bad for the surveyor, who is losing sleep over what in the hell is going on. The reason I kept out of it for the most part is that I am also a broker, and was hesitant to involve myself in another broker’s deal.
So you stayed out for the ethics of being involved in deal of the other broker rather than the ethical dilemma that your survey might have been challenged on the basis of your relationship to your grandson? Don’t get me wrong, I think you were correct to stay out of it, but I think you should have stayed out of it because neighbors might have said you were changing the lines to make your grandson come out ahead.
I have actually been in a case like this once. Got a call from land owner to come survey, cannot find jack that works where it should be. Start digging around, have an old survey by a guy that usually does great work. Neighbor wants to tag along and show me where the corners are. He walks me to a stone and says that is the corner and starts getting mad when I am looking 100+’ onto “his” property saying he has already shown me the corner. I inform him that according to the records at the court house, that surveyor put a nail at the base of the stone. Start buzzing and low and behold the nail is still there, right where I was looking. This is where the guy starts bad mouthing the other surveyor saying he was drunk on the job when he was out there (said surveyor does not drink, but he does not know that I know the PC). I tell him that the other guys survey matches the records prior to that in the court house and then he pulls back his jacket to show me his gun and says that he said the stone was the corner. Well I left and about a month later my boss convinced me to return. The old fence I had followed down to the stone, it was now another 250′ onto the land of the guy we were doing the survey work for. I just got back in the truck and we drove home. Heard from another surveyor a county away that he had been appointed by a judge to survey the property about a year and a half later. Both the plaintiff (our former client) and the defendant (mister six shooter) told the judge that no surveyor in three counties would come out to survey the property. Gee, I wonder why:beer:
My bet is on one of the neighbors moving corners.
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Joe is the guardian.
As far as I know he is not trying to practice without a license.
It is his property (for now) and I’m not aware of any statute that says you can’t survey your own property. It may not have any standing, but you can do it (at your peril). Regardless, he was just following the surveyor around. -
I am always hesitant to survey for someone I have a personal relationship with for that exact reason. No need to introduce even the perception of bias towards one owner or another. It was the main factor in my decision to not be involved beyond showing him some corners.
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Roadhand,
“This is obviously a violation of NC law. “Joe in tow” can easily be construed as surveying without a license. I have already tried to reach the director at home but to no avail. I will be on the phone to the board on MOnday morning.”
Hoping this is an attempt at humor. Where is the violation of law?
WTF? Over.
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Good to hear, JB. Let us know what the final outcome is, this sounds interesting!
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Yes sir. Strictly Humor. paraphrasing responses that you MIGHT have gotten on the old POB site. A reference to the movie Airplane also. I was probably the only one that got it, as is typical of my sense of humor. My apologies.
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I got it Roadie.
You really would have done good if you had found a way to add 0.04′ a stone and an iron into your comments. Maybe a slam about how much easier it is to survey in colonial rather than PLSS too.
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To Quote Myself
“You did precisely the correct thing.”
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To Quote Myself
I wonder how much the realtor got for his work.
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